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COMMENTS

Back to serious topics for TL;DRs. Woohoo! This one is a subject that we’ve avoided for a long time, but I think we had enough to say about the subject now so that we could make a video about it, even though, we know, it’s impossible to talk about everything at once. Hopefully we could talk about it more here and in the comments :D

A few things we didn’t talk about in the video:

Though we’re more understanding about plastic surgery, and the blunt practicality of plastic surgery here in Seoul, we’re starting to wonder where we would draw the line, if we would draw one at all. It feels as if plastic surgery is a bit TOO accepted here, you know? Here’s something that surprised us and still surprises us to this day: plastic surgery is often given as gifts for good grades in school. Aced that exam? Here’s some double eyelid surgery for you! Passed the top of your class? You deserve a jaw shaving! While, yes, we know that getting these surgeries will give people in Korea better opportunities in the work force, it just feels like it’s too early to give to students. Too early! The idea iss being planted in them from a young age that specific looks are unacceptable, and something about it just reeks of innocence being lost. No? Am I romanticizing things a bit?

This is why we were a bit upset at Minzy getting a nose job. Don’t get us wrong: she has all the right to do whatever she wants to her body, and we’re not trying to deprive her of that right. We just don’t like how it all went down. YG denied that she had surgery at first, and said something along the lines of “oh noez she didn’t get surgery she just got older and byutifuller!” Minzy afterwards contradicted that and said that, yes, she got a nose job, but only because she suffers from rhinitis or something.

Now, I don’t know what her real motives are. I feel like the rhinitis excuse is BS. I googled if rhinoplasty will affect rhinitis, and online doctors said that it won’t, but it’s the freaking internet so it could be all lies. Hell, I’m a certifieded doctor as well! Believe me! Point is, I don’t believe her reason, and I feel like maybe other people don’t believe it as well. But that’s not what irks me. We just really thought that Minzy looked great before. Absolutely freaking adorable! There wasn’t anything wrong with her nose at all. She looked really lovely, and it felt like, for once, here was a major idol that embraced how she looked and didn’t cave into the pressure to change her appearance. Here was someone who could be a positive role model for high school girls with image issues. But…not anymore. Her nose looks nothing like what it was before, and she got it changed because she didn’t like the way it looked, which is telling other people with similar noses that theirs don’t look good, either. Again, Minzy has all the right in the world to do what she pleases with her body, and hers isn’t the job to be Korea’s self-esteem compass; I just don’t really like the circumstances around the surgery nor the message this instance sends.

Another thing we wanted to talk about in this post is getting plastic surgery in Korea as a foreigner. We’ve heard a few terrible things which have, in turn, scared the bajesus out of us. Namely, how do you, as a foreigner, place your trust in a surgeon? How do you prevent doctor swapping when you’re unconscious, for example? For those of you who don’t know, Doctor Swapping is the instance in which you would pay for surgery from, say, a great doctor with a fantastic reputation, but as soon as you’re unconscious they put in a different, lesser qualified doctor. Or what about companies that offer translation services for you as a medical tourist, and they recommend good clinics for you, but that’s at times only because they have a relationship with that clinic that’ll charge you double what they normally charge, for which the translator will get a cut of that cheque. Even in the forums that you read online, people are hired to post comments and give positive reviews. Fabricated online sentiments aren’t uncommon here.
Plastic surgery is big business in South Korea, and lots of money exchanges hands, and – unfortunately – business ethics when dealing with foreigners aren’t really the highest priority.

 

I don’t know. Those are some things to keep in mind, I guess. If you’re more interested in the topic, a friend of ours runs a good site on Plastic Surgery in Korea. He knows a lot more about the subject than we do, and has a bunch of good articles there if you want to look into it more.

Yeah! That’s it for this week’s serious TL;DR topic. Let us know what you think in the comment section below. We know this is a sensitive issue, and we really hope we didn’t offend too many people! Ah! Otherwise, if you like TL;DRs like this, make sure you click on this fancy pants button here. It’ll cure your rhinitis! I’m a doctor and I know!

ToFebruary
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  1. Uh guys, plastic surgery actually means the same thing here. No really, I’m serious! I know this video is a few months old and you may never see this, but I really wanted to mention this because I feel like it’s a shame to leave you uninformed about it.
    Think about the term “brain plasticity” what does that mean? It’s synonymous with brain malleability, and that’s not a mistake. In fact the whole reason why ‘plastic’ the substance was called plastic is *because* it’s so incredibly malleable. It gained the confrontation of ‘fake’ and all those other things long after with the rise in popularity of the substance named for it’s moldable nature.
    However plastic surgery was a term coined before plastic became popular, and the popularity and subsequent ascription of all those negative connotations to ‘plastic’ is actually fluke that had side effects for ‘plastic’ surgery.
    So there you go, in fact our surgery initially was named in equivalence to ‘morph surgery’, and in theory, if we were being careful and specific with our understanding of language, still is.

  2. DaYoung Yun

    I just remembered what video I watched that I wanted to share. Although it is a dove commercial, it still sends a good message.

    http://youtu.be/litXW91UauE

  3. Minzy had been suffering from rhinitis, on the hospital, they told her its because of her crooked nose, she was sopoustu get surgery for a perfect recovery. Then her mother sugestet that if she will have an operation then why she will not take a plastic surgery. Thats why she have it.

  4. Simon and Martina, I have a question! What does it mean to eat tofu as soon as you get out of jail? Is it some kind of purification ritual or they just really miss the tofu? jajaja I’m really curious about it!

  5. This is really scary

  6. Rhinitis is the same excuse Ashlee Simpson and Ashley Tisdale used a few years ago when they got nose jobs. So that they can sing better. On one hand I get it, but I wish they would have also said something like “and I kind of wanted to get a prettier nose”. Because if you were really cool with your nose, you would find away to work around the rhinitis. Doing breathing exercises and stuff.
    But yeah, I agree with the Minzy thing. If YG had just been like “Yes, she did. She can’t breathe well.” But lying about it first just creates that culture of you have to be naturally pretty, because heaven forbid you do something that would make you happier with your appearance.

  7. The problem is people in korea is that people are way too obsessed with being pretty. When I meet my mum ‘s korean ahjumma friends, they all say to me and my sister, “Oh, you’re so pretty.” We’re not even thaat pretty, and even so, it annoys that that’s the first thing that comes to their minds when they meet us. It’s just sad how obsessed korean people are with beauty. And how high schoolers can get plastic surgery? That’s totally sick – I can’t believe people my age would actually go that far.

  8. Just wondering… you mentioned something about getting your moles removed, do you remember the name of the clinic where you got it ? I am planning to go to korea soon and I actually need to get mine removed because I had my braces taken off and they’re starting to become crooked again because of that “unwanted” mole

  9. Here’s a list of JCI certified hospitals and clinics in South Korea. http://www.healthcareabroad.com/korea-south/plastic-surgery

  10. Can you guys please talk about how kpop is accepted in Korean with males and females? Like in the US a lot of kids or teens who are males get bullied for liking pop. Is it the same in Korea?

  11. For Martina and Simon: Since having moved from Canada to South Korea have you guys ever been hit on by Korean’s? Have you guys received many compliments for your looks?

  12. For Martina and Simon: Since having moved from Canada to South Korea have you guys ever been hit on by Korean’s? Have you guys received many compliments for your looks?

  13. Shegotthatsomething

    This is what they call pretty (even if you have done PS)

  14. Shegotthatsomething

    Ideal beauty standards are ridiculous to ang mohs like EYK

    For the Nose: it must be sharp and pointed
    Eyes: Almond shaped and double eyelids
    Face:Heart-shaped
    Skin:white (or glow in the dark white)
    Body:fuck this shit lol just be as skinny as a pair of chopsticks

  15. I have a question I want to ask kpop fans. Is there a place like Spotify that is for kpop? Or a place that has a lot of kpop? I have Spotify but it doesn’t have very many Korean artists that I listen to on there. Is there a site that I can find that is free?

  16. I have chronic hyperplastic rhino-sinusitis (it’s pretty similar to what Minzy claims she had) and my doctor said, surgery is really just as a last resort (mind, it is a goddamn pain in the ass, I have to rinse my sinuses multiple times a day with a saltwater solution), however, a colleague of mine had the surgery done and though it is not necessary to change the appearance of the nose for the surgery, they will repeatedly ask whether you want any changes to your nose, probably to save you from having to go through another surgery if you did want to change something. So, yeah, that’s pretty much the deal with the whole rhinitis thing

  17. What do koreans think about homeschoolers? I have a friend over there who didn’t understand what it meant. Do other koreans never hear about? Also, I was considering about attending a college there, would my homeschooled background affect it at all? Thanks.

  18. Raine

    HAd to pause and laugh..essence releaser? Really Simon? BWAHAHAHA! I find my favorite looking female celebrities are the ones with unusual faces. Hyorin from Sistar, Ha Ji-won, Han Groo. They’re not beautiful in the typical manner and have very different features from the ideal. But to compensate, they also have incredible bodies. Those faces that are all the same are scary and a little confusing when you’re learning names for your favorite groups…

  19. Considering the prevalence and popularity of plastic surgery in Korea, I find it completely mind boggling how some fans can be utterly delusional about their favorite idols looks being “natural” or otherwise. People seem to create arguments for completely contradictory ideas… For example, blepharoplasty/”double eyelid surgery” really isn’t a big deal; it’s like make-up VS. *fill in the name blank* never had any surgery, he/she just lost a lot of weight!! If plastic surgery ISN’T a big deal, then why does it matter if a certain K-Pop idol has had a procedure done or not? So long as they are adults and making their own informed decision, it shouldn’t be a big deal in a culture where plastic surgery is so common.

  20. in your next tldr can you please talk about sasaengs? i’ve heard some bad stuff about them but how bad could they be?

  21. The trouble with saying only specific looks are okay is the slippery slope to fascist, race-based concentration camps that promises.

  22. Sad :(

  23. Okay, so this question may never make it to a TL;DR but I still have to ask, and I’ll probably be a pest about it ^_^ but I was wondering… are there hardware/gardening stores commonly found in Korea? From the little I gather about their culture, I’m guessing DIY home-improvement isn’t a big thing… what about gardening and stuff?

    This question popped into my mind when I saw your instagram video about grocery shopping in Canada actually… I was thinking, what if I wanted to live in Korea and wanted to some of the stuff that couldn’t be easily found, even if it was indoors or something. Is that popular at all?

    When I move out of my parents’ I feel like I could live comfortably in a one-bedroom or studio apartment (“western sizes”, since Asian tolerance for smaller apartments is higer haha) with it being filled with plants.

    Thanks! ^_^

  24. Hi there. I’d also like the name of a recommended place to get mole removal. I looked at the link EYK provided but it’s all for places in the U.S. Simon, Martina pretty please.

  25. Hey there, first time commenting here. I have a topic that I was hoping you might cover some time in the future: corporal punishment in school. The reason is that I was in school until I think 1st grade (I think I came to America in 1979 – oh god I’m old!) and my memory of Korea is pretty hazy but I remember 2 things really well. I remember everything I ate (more food segments please!) and all the punishment I received in school. Remember, I didn’t even get that far in the school system – 1st grade people. I remember the rulers to the hand, having to hold buckets in the hallway and being slapped open handed on the cheek. I don’t remember what I did to get the punishment but there you have it. Both my parents were teachers in Korea. My mom was a music teacher in the countryside and she was a little thing that looked like she weighed 90lbs soaking wet so I don’t think she did much beating. But then, she was always deadly with those laser side eyes so maybe she didn’t need it. She did however tell me that she witnessed male teacher beating the crap out of male students with just about anything they could get their hands on and it always horrified her. Didn’t want to ask my Dad because I didn’t want to think that way about him… I love the fact that Korean Movies like “Attack the Gas Station” tells people to assume a particular position during a stick up and they all seem to know these positions because they’re popular stress positions used by the school system. How have things changed in the school system in the now? Have they moved onto just being verbally abusive and physical abuse is frowned upon? Another side item: Is Parent’s Night at school still a time where they bribed teachers with gifts to favors their kids? Just curious.

  26. Aphrielle Rodriguez

    HELP!!!I AM TRYING TO TEST AND FIGUREOUT THIS THEORY!!!!!

    ok. so when you are born in Korea you are considered 1 year already.

    including the NEW YEARS and BIRTHDAYS, I think it is +2 years per year.

    so like if a child were born they are already 1 year. on 1990

    +1 on a birthday(the next year)=2 years old 1991

    +1 on a new years=3years old 1993

    (!warning!:all of what I am saying is a educated guess)

    EX:T.O.P: he is actually 26 years old in western time(in 2013), but the plus one from the day he was born gave him the age of 27 in Korea. but right now on new years he turns 28 because of the +1 from his day or birth and +1 from new years.

    oh I will use Taeyang as a example too

    ok so he is now 27 years one year younger then TOP(28)

    his birthday passed so you -1 year(26)

    and in western time, thanks to the Korean way. ”when a baby is born they are already one year old ”so you -1 from the s]age again(26-1)which =25

    and see how Taeyang and TOPs ages connect made with the same theory

    Taeyang will always stay younger then TOP will

    TAEYANG and TOP ages in Korea:27 and 28

    TAEYANG and TOP ages in the western part:25 and 26

    see how they are only 1 year apart from each other by subtracting the +one year form birth and the +1 year from new years

    OMO…..I THINK I JUST BROKE THE CODE THROUGH KOREAN AGING!

    high five me!

  27. I realise this may be a serious topic but I can only focus on ‘Swamp-Donkey’. I can’t wait to use this as an insult :DDD

  28. This video was very informative, but I don’t like the way you guys expressed your disapproval of plastic surgery.
    You say that, when two people who have both gotten plastic surgery have a child, he/she would be a “swamp donkey.” But then you proceed to say that he/she would probably get plastic surgery in the future, “continuing this awful life-cycle.”
    So, if he/she stays natural, he/she gets insulted for his/her appearance.
    If he/she gets plastic surgery, he/she is criticized for it.
    Unless you’re born attractive, there’s no way you can really win.
    I’m not saying plastic surgery is a good thing, but a society that doesn’t reprimand less attractive people for trying to improve their appearance through surgery (in this case, South Korea) sounds a lot better to me than a society that claims to accept all kinds of people despite their appearance, but dislikes people who are born ugly, either because they’re unattractive (having chosen not to have surgery) or fake (having chosen to have surgery).
    It seems really hypocritical and unfair, especially since most other aspects of western culture usually try to promote fairness.

  29. Well done. Beautifully articulated.

  30. Hey lads, been watching the videos through the holidays and still don’t have a hint about the following:
    How environmentally concerned/green is South Korea? Do you e.g. separate your garbage, save water, collect paper, etc.?

  31. Let’s say that im korean high school girl with a darker skin and I don’t really have the Korea beauty look. Am I gonna get bully or being ignore by my schoolmates ? I know they were like really care about looks but is it serious ? Can I ‘survive’ or even make friends ? Or plastic surgery is the only choice for me. I’ve heard about Korean high school girl suicides is it related to how do they look or what ?
    d(0_0)b Am I asking too much questions ? Mianheyo, kunggumheseoyo.
    Sorry for the bad English, it’s my second language.

  32. I had heard a lot about the contraversal topic about plastic sugery in south Korea and how it was affecting young girls self esteem
    and that of body image without really looking up the topic but knowing that quite a few kpop stars were getting it done both male and female shocking that rate of beauty standards apply so much too both men and women

  33. Hi Simon and Martina,

    Your videos are great and you are inspiring many of us to plan a trip to South Korea! I think most of us that love watching EYK plan to one day visit Korea.

    Could you please do a segment on budgeting for a 7 day trip to Korea?

    For example… Just some ballpark figures, how much ₩ per day, for each scenario
    Scenario 1: Live luxuriously. Nice hotels, fine dining
    Scenario 2: Explorer. Traditional Hanoks, Street food and some fine dining
    Scenario 3: Cheap and nasty! Tell me the cheapest 7 days I can spend in Korea

    I know this is a broad topic. Perhaps you could focus purely on the food aspect as I am finding this difficult to budget for. Or maybe you could tell us about expenses that tourists aren’t aware of? The best ways to save your money in Korea and still explore? etc. etc.

    Reveal to me how expensive a week in Korea is.

    Keep up the great work,
    Jack

    • Super cheap. If you’re traveling w/someone scope out a room on airbnb. Not sure I’d be willing to do this solo…safety is important too. Pick something that’s close to a metro stop for cheap travel. Even cheaper. … If you have friends in S Korea, you might line up free room for a week if you pick up their classes while they are on vacation. (Word of warning: You are not legally allowed to teach in Korea unless you have an E2 visa. … But you would not be the first nor the last person to do this.)

  34. Not-Really-Normal^__~
    Not-Really-Normal^__~

    What are you thoughts and feelings on SHINee’s Jonghyun openly supporting the LGTB movement how is korea reacting do you think changes are starting in korea concerning LGTB? do you think he will be getting a lot of back lash?
    thanks

  35. How do people feel about cursing in Korea? How is it received publicly compared to North America? Is there any significant difference?

  36. I’ve never heard of doctor swapping. That’s scary as hell.

  37. Please take down the photos of the girl on the first and third photo on the 6:32 mark… :( They were used without her permission and has been mis-labeled as someone who has done plastic surgery [and she hasn't!].

    • Who is she? Honestly, it’s really hard for me to believe that she is natural…unless she did a ton of photoshop. Also, didn’t she post them online ie for public viewing? Posting your pics on instagram is a double edged sword – you get compliments but you also get criticisms.

      • but that doesnt mean you can put it up on a video where a lot of ppl watch and think that it is a true fact. and i do know her, she has never done any plastic surgery, and yes it is true she does photoshop but she does not do it a lot that much as u will think her as 성괴. and it is against the law to take someone’s picture without permission

      • wow you’re rude

  38. What kind of things will kill you in Korea? In the US there are rattlesnakes, brown recluse spiders, crocodiles and alligators, tornadoes, hurricanes, dust storms and blizzards. What do you have to be wary of there?

    • Traffic!!! (Not even the sidewalks are safe. Stress. (Lots of suicides). Washed out bridges, especially at night. Box fans. (Google fan death).

  39. In Kpop, I have noticed a lot of idols get plastic surgery, and for some it is quite obvious, I don’t mind the fact that they got it done, but on the fact that many deny it. When the yg statement of Minzy’s getting prettier due to age came out I was very upset. It was obvious the girl had a new nose, yet they had to go and deny it. When Minzy finally came out and admitted it I was happy, mad at YG for trying to deny it but happy that she admitted it. My opinion concerning plastic surgery is if you had worked done on your face, body, or whatever own up to it. Its a decision you wanted and if you are happy with it then be proud, it is not like the world will end. I think the fact that many celebrities/idols are getting plastic surgery make those who don’t get it more special, especially if they are not considered your typical beauty. An example would be Minzy’s own team member, CL. CL admitted that YG had actually suggested her to get some work done and she denied it. She decided to stand up and say no, that alone says a lot. Any ways I think you guys handled the subject well! Oh and here is the link the interview where CL admitted to denying plastic surgery! http://www.elle.com/news/culture/cl-2ne1-jeremy-scott-muse

  40. IM SO SERIOUS RIGHT NOW. she never has done any plastic surgery. please put down the picture or delete it please. you guys r going too far now. i get that you guys r trying to explain about korea so ppl can understand and know more about korea but this, srsly? is too far. im not talking about the video itself, but the plctures you guys have put up is too far. have you guys asked the owner of the picture? do you guys actually know her? well i do and i do know she has never done any plastic surgery. she is very stressed because of ppl who just judge her by how she looks and just call her 성괴 and everybody including me around her ,i ncluding herself would be upset about it. please put down the pic or delete the video.

  41. I wish that a kpop star would say something like ur beautiful just the way ur especially without PLASTIC SURGERY!!! If a kpop star did and more people joined the society in Korea might change into something new and better

  42. Hey, since the World Cup is coming up next year, could you guys please talk about the sports culture in Korea? What is the most popular sport in Korea, and what is the atmosphere, food, etc. like at live sports? Thank you!

  43. What really upsets me about Minzy’s nose job is that I felt that her mother was egging her to get it, when she was initially okay with how she looks. The extent on how the people she loves are commenting about how much better she’ll look with a nose job just gives me the impression that her mum is telling her, “Sweetie, you don’t look good naturally. But hey, Let me give you my blessings to change your appearance!” is pretty appalling to me. This is coming from her “confession” which I read on allkpop, so how true this is or isn’t, the idea that parents are more than willing to suggest to their kids that they don’t look good and want them to go through surgery is what troubles me.

  44. Is eyelid surgery really plastic surgery? Isn’t plastic surgery only where plastic is involved? Like silicon for breast implants and like stuff for nose jobs? My grandma got eyelid surgery only because of her old age, her eye lids have drooped so much that she found it difficult to see (lol) so she went and got it done, she said it was a quick and easy procedure. I don’t know why a lot of young people in Korea are getting it done though, everyone should accept the way the are :)
    And mole removal is definitely not plastic surgery either, is Korea placed high on the list of countries who have the most plastic surgery because they included the statistics of eye lid surgery and mole removal??

    Oh and another fact contributing to to why some people in Korea like getting face changes, is because Koreans have something called face ki or kee, I’m not sure if that’s the right name, but some Koreans believe that a certain energy comes from facial features which can determine your luck and personality in life. For example I heard that some Koreans think that if someones eyebrows are very far apart, that means that they tend to be more wasteful than others. And if you can see someones nostrils very clearly without the person tilting their head up, means that the person can tend to not be able to keep secrets. Weird huh?

    And Koreans where always very aesthetic orientated people, kind of like the Athenians in Ancient Greece, they loved arts and crafts like pottery, music, painting and poetry. Traditional homes were always built to be aesthetically pleasing as well as functional. They even patterned and decorated metal chop sticks. So, Koreans always like beautifying things, now even people huh?

    • Taken from Wikipedia: “Plastic surgery is a medical specialty concerned with the “correction” or restoration of form and function. Though cosmetic or aesthetic surgery is the best-known kind of plastic surgery, most plastic surgery is not cosmetic;[2] plastic surgery includes many types of reconstructive surgery, hand surgery, microsurgery, and the treatment of burns.”

      And I believe they mentioned that in Korea the word ‘plastic’ is not used in the word for those surgeries. It has nothing to do with ‘ plastic’. In fact you could get a skin graft for a burn or had a finger reattached and technically that is ‘ plastic surgery.’. Some ‘Plastic Surgeons deal with serious issues like cleft palates, burns, deformed limbs, skin deformities and a whole set of other things. So yes, when your grandmother got her eyes fixed, she technically had ‘plastic surgery’. It could have been categorized as ‘cosmetic/aesthetic’ or a ‘reconstructive’ plastic surgery.

  45. I dunno. I can understand why people do it, if you’re unhappy with the way you look and want to change it then why not? People go on diets, have braces fitted, wear make up for the same reasons.
    But it’s the whole ‘clone-y’ look that frightens me a bit.
    Like in that photo of the prospective Miss Korea’s they all have almost identical eye shapes, nose shapes and face shapes. There’s no distinct features that makes any of them stand out.
    I don’t think beauty should be defined by one look. Not gonna lie, I find that a bit creepy.

    • Hmmm well I can see the differences between the women, they don’t all look the same to me. Their make up is all done similarly, and some of them could of gotten some surgery but they don’t all look like clones to me…
      Just my observation.

      Yeah I agree, many women and girls are unhappy with the way they look. Some apply contouring make up to make their noses look higher or narrower, eyeliner to make their eyes stand out, add fake eyelashes to make their eyelashes longer, foundation to hide blemishes, go to tanning salons to make their skin darker and some get nose jobs and double eye lids. Where do you draw the line? Isn’t getting a nose job the same as applying contouring make up but permanent? It sure is a complicated matter.

  46. Hi Simon and Marina, I was wondering if you guys could talk about
    auditions and being scouted by SM, JYP, YG, etc. I’m really curious
    about the auditions and scouting of idols.

  47. Hi S&M, hope you are doing fine! Oooohhh you sooo nasty!!!!
    Can you tell us about how the Koreans view someone who is handicapped?
    I noticed that most of Asian countries does have some stigma going on about disabled person and as an Asian living in an Asian country, I can pretty much say the stigma IS going on in my country. I just want to know whether Korea view things differently since they are so advance in terms of technology. Thanks

  48. my friend’s friend was added on the video as a 성괴 but i also heard that u didn’t ask permission to use that I feel it wasn’t professional for you guys to upload something that might hurt someone’s feelings…she didn’t even do plastic surgery

    • I believe they used those girl’s photos to demonstrate how similiar their facial structure is. No bad intentions attached.
      And they didn’t directly called the girls 성괴, just mentioned that some people call them that.
      And you don’t know how they came across your friend’s friend picture, maybe it just appeared on google or something with no names/ id attached.

  49. I think this was handled well because I struggle to discuss plastic surgery as a cultural phenomena–it is people’s right to do what they want with their body, but the decision to have plastic surgery often comes from external social pressures, so it may be a reflection of an ill of the world’s society placing such values on looks that is having this kind of impact on people. Many people talk about the boost of confidence they get fro their plastic surgery, how they become more comfortable with themselves, and that’s like, power to you. Be comfortable. But it is just sad to see that what made them uncomfortable may be other people, and that is just , I think that is a big concern. We criticize people who get plastic surgery but I think that is totally backwards–it is about everything outside them pushing them to do it. Also, I want to make clear that some of these decisions may be very internal, and outside pressure may not be the case for all plastic surgery patients.

    The comments around parents and their children are a little troubling though–I think this is an example of the shaming that perpetuates images and societal pressures that pushed people to have plastic surgery. Why do we shame or belittle people who do not fit our ideal standard? Where and who does our ideal standard come from, who maintains it, who criticizes it? I think these are interesting questions to think about in your personal cultural context. I would not apply it to another, because as a non-member of that culture you don’t have the agency to understand of criticize.

  50. I wrote a paper on PS in south korea for my school and one of the reasons why, and please correct me if i’m wrong, is because the job market is very competitive. The prettier people generally are more likely to be hired than the less pretty people so many people try to get PS so they are more likely to be picked. Therefore the culture has quickly accepted plastic surgery.

    High school students are often given plastic surgery so that when they enter the workforce they will have adapted to their new looks and the surgery won’t be as fresh. Parents think that by doing this they will be setting up their children for a better future.

    • Yes indeed. Only about 60% of newly graduate college student find full time jobs within 6 months of graduation. And that stat does not include people who are going to graduate school, entering military, study abroad, participate in volunteer activity etc etc Fresh graduate who find reasonably acceptable position, never mind dream job, is thought to be in single digit.

  51. You pointed out some things that I didn’t know about plastic surgery in Korea. Namely the word/meaning used for it in Korea. That does explain maybe a little on how there’s not such a high stigma of it there. But I still gotta say I don’t agree with it unless it’s for health issues. I had a friend who looked into getting a breast reduction because of back problems. If she had the money to pay for it, she totally would have had it done.

    The things that ticked me off about the Minzy nose surgery ordeal is the way her mom told her to get it done. The articles I read in which Minzy explained the reason for the surgery is she wasn’t really all that keen on getting it done. But then her mom said she needed to get it done so she’d be more pretty. To hear that from your own mother that you aren’t pretty enough?! Ugh…I’m just disgusted. I’ve had to hear the same kind of stuff from my mom and used to feel like crap about myself. I also think Minzy looked just fine before. Now she looks weird. This is my personal opinion here, but I think she looks worse now than she did before.

    But I feel that way about a lot of these Kpop stars who get plastic surgery. You see the before and after pictures and I’m just like, no wonder something looked off about them. The eye thing really creeps me out. The big, widened eyes are so unhuman it’s spooky to me. I personally like the monolid. On some Korean artists who have this I think it’s quite sexy and appealing actually.

    Image is such a huge issue in Korea and so people run to surgery to help it. But what really needs worked on is their self-esteem about themselves. That’s my personal opinion. I mean I may not be the greatest looking; I think I’m quite the plain Jane actually. Several people have told me I’m ugly. It took a lot of time to overcome that. But now I’m better for it. I’m happy about my not-so-great features. I’m me and if someone has a problem with it then that’s their problem not mine. The only thing physically I don’t like about myself right now is that I’m overweight. Which I brought on myself by keeping unhealthy habits. Now I work out everyday and am eating better. So what I did to myself I’m fixing. Everything about the way God made me is perfect just as is.

  52. Martina, about the monolid being on Asians, it’s only some that have it. From what I know, lots of it are on Koreans (?) but I’m not too sure. I’m Chinese and I have double eyelids, and so do my friends and family. My family was shocked when I told them about nearly all Koreans having monolids, because in China, lots of people have natural double eyelids. I’m not too sure about Koreans though, since I don’t know many Koreans in real life :

  53. Just want to second what you said about stigmas being different in different countries.
    Martina was offended because plastic surgery has a negative stigma in her country (Canada), but they dude who offered the nose job wasn’t trying to offend her, because plastic surgery doesn’t have that stigma in his country (South Korea).
    In that case, is:
    1) Martina being too uptight and butthurt by being offended by something that wasn’t meant to be offensive
    2) The dude being offensive and tactless by mentioning something that could possibly be offensive to others?

    I’ve always wondered this, because I’ve moved around a lot of countries, and found that a term or reference that is completely harmless in one country can make people go ballistic in others. It’s only after I get told off by someone from some other country, that I realise it had a negative connotation. For example, I grew up using the term ‘Jap’ as just a shorter version of ‘Japanese’. In Australia, it’s really common and has no stigma attached, as far as I’m aware of. We used in in Japanese class all the time, heck even the Japanese kids used it. But then some American Japanese person got offended, which shocked me (apparently it was a derogatory term used in the US in WWII). I’ve avoided using it around Americans since.
    Other common examples includes asking people about their age and weight and income. Eg. Thai people ask for your age almost right after asking for your name, so they can know how to address you. But people in Australia often find that too personal or invasive or something?

    In that light, I just have one request; could people perhaps refrain from judging and condemning people from other countries, when they happen to do/say something offensive? Because chances are they were not aware of the negative stigma that it has in other cultures. You can’t help feeling offended, because that could just be a reflex emotional reaction, but instead of unleashing your wrath on the perpetrator, you could just gently explain how it could be offensive, so that they can be more careful around people from that culture in the future. Because if people tend to blow up all the time, I’d end up trying to avoid them completely.

    • I agree.
      ‘Don’t take offence unless offence was intended.’ that’s my personal ethos on this ^^

    • I don’t quite agree with the don’t take offense unless offence was intended bit. Koreans are still super racist and stereotypical of black people and if someone made a comment like “black people steal”, you should of course correct their conceptions – they might think it’s the truth and don’t mean to be malicious but that doesn’t mean you shouldn’t be offended. For Zwarte Piet, the Dutch still do blackface which is not right even if they see it as something silly

      • Well, I did mention that being offended, or becoming angry, is an emotion; and it’s not really something that we can control. What we can control, though, is how we express that feeling; and ideally we do it in a way that will be helpful for both sides.
        I just personally think that flipping out in anger doesn’t usually have the best results. It’s a bit like disciplining a child; the first time they do something wrong, you explain why it’s wrong. The second, or third time, you can be more expressive, because the kid is doing it in spite of knowing that it’s wrong.
        The problem with foreigners being offensive is that people skip the whole explaining step, and go straight to being angry. Not that helpful, imo.

  54. You look awesome Simon! I love that sweater on you!

  55. matchacakes

    Okay, I can’t get it out of my head – does anyone remember the documentary made about the Korean version of beauty a year or so ago? I’m trying to remember what it was called. It had an American girl who enrolled in high school in Korea after she had graduated Stateside so she could really get into the thought process of Korean girls. It had tons of interviews with school girls who both had and wanted to have plastic surgery.

    Does anyone know the name? Or has anyone seen it?

  56. Nooo! Minzy’s nose was so cute. :( I totally agree, you guise- there seems to be a bit TOO much appreciation for plastic surgery. Maybe it’s the US Southerner in me, but everyone is beautiful in their own way and it’s just really sad to me that so many people think they need to “Reform” their face or whatever to be beautiful. Arrrrggghhhhh.

  57. The eye-lid fold is called the epicantic fold.

    • No, the epicanthic fold is a small flap down the inside of the eye, going down to the nose. Some people with monolids have it, but so do some people with double lids — epicanthic folds are often found in the Sami of Finland, and in Nordic populations, for example. There is a surgery to get rid of them as well (sadly, IMO): epicanthoplasty for the fold near the nose, while blepharoplasty is the surgery that converts single eyelids to doubled ones.

  58. Wait… You don´t have to put your picture in sour resume in north america? It is totally normal in Germany…

  59. Okay I go a question and I hope someone can answer it.
    From what I heard from friends is that if you’re still young (highschool student) you aren’t aloud to do specific thinks to your appearance (like dying your hair)
    I was planning on going to Korea as an exchange student so was worried on how they would judge me or if the hey would even let ne sincerely I dyed my hair purple and more.
    Since you both used to be teachers, how are the rules about physical appearance and do they also count for foreigners?
    I hope you can answer my question! It doesn’t even have to be in a video but just an answer is alright.
    thanks~~~
    nasty4life!!!

  60. The eyes…oh god the eyes! It’s Korean Barbie!(6:32)

    Whatever, if they want to look like they just came out of an anime or a manwha that’s there choice. Plastic surgery on some people cant hurt but a lot of people go to far and a lot of them don’t really need it.

    Not that this chick is even in the same universe as most plastic surgery loving people but….
    Speaking of plastic surgery and Barbie….

    http://likes.com/weird/meet-the-reallife-barbie-doll

  61. One thing that really bothers me about plastic surgery, I do believe everyone has the right to do what they want with their body and I’m not opposed to plastic surgery, but wouldn’t you want to know what your husband or wife looked like without the surgery? I mean, I keep seeing the term “suitable” used to describe how Koreans pick a husband and wife. Well are you “suitable” looking enough? Is my friend “suitable” enough to have her sogaeting with my guy friend? Like really? The base appearance is all that matters? That’s why that article about the guy suing his wife blew my mind. Don’t deny it, it’s obvious that she’s had at least a few surgeries. How in the world did he NOT ask to see what she looked like before? Maybe it’s just me, but I wouldn’t want a guy who is completely reformed by surgery.. Maybe it’s the western in me, but I believe natural (unless for medical reasons) is always best.

  62. Hello from montreal!
    I just had a quick question – my girlfriend is in korea for the holidays and I wanted to surprise her family and send them a gift basket. The ones I found online that deliver locally to korea tend to be really expensive. Do you have any particular suggestions? Or is it better to mail a gift basket?

    thanks!
    paolo
    ps. Love the TLDR segment, super useful :)

  63. You were talking about what if two “hot” people got together and had not-so-hot children? There was a story going around the internet about a man divorcing his wife because she hadn’t told him about her plastic surgery and then bore unattractive children. Thankfully it turned out to be a hoax, but it did create this meme.

    http://weknowmemes.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/05/plastic-surgery-you-cant-hide-it-forever.jpg

  64. @Simon and Martina: Which clinics in South Korea would you recommend to foreigners to get things like mole removal done for a good price, and that can be trusted?

  65. @Simon and Martina What clinics in South Korea would you recommend for foreigners to get things like mole removal done for a good price, and is legit?

  66. @Simon and Martina: What clinics in South Korea would you recommend for foreigners to get things like mole removal done for a good price, and is legit?

  67. Most of us probably have a deviated septum and partially collapsed airways. If you have the ability to breathe correctly from your nose you feel more awake, alert and can keep your mouth closed, improving your oral health and hygiene as well. You’ll also catch less colds. We neglect and damage our bodies without even thinking about the function of our parts.

  68. I’m gonna push the boat out here and say I actually applaud Minzy for getting it done – assuming it was her own choice. It’s not her responsibility to make other people feel good about themselves. I know people seem sad that she did it, and personally I also think she looked better before, but heck – if SHE wasn’t happy with it then I think she’s right for changing it. She’s still Minzy, still has an incredible voice, still an amazing dancer, still the same personality. I just don’t understand why people seem to take the PC version of things when PS is being discussed – leave people alone and let them do what they want, it’s not harming anyone~

  69. Hey Simon and Martina, I think you using the MISS KOREA candidates as the video’s image is not a good idea, because beauty pageants around the world are full of fixed up women. Whether you’re in Brazil, U.S. Canada, or Europe, a lot of pageant contestants got something tweaked (eyes, brows, boos, whatever it is)

  70. where did you get the picture of the girl? she is my friend and i do know that she did not do any plastic surgery. seriously, i know you want to tell ppl some information about korea but now i think you guys are going too far. i hope you guys would put down that picture soon. she is really mad right now. im not even kidding. all her friends including me right now is very upset.

  71. LongClawTiger

    With so many people focused on an ideal look, does it ever seem like that might actually help the people who choose not to have anything done? Like you have so many Barbie and Ken dolls that they just give this “meh” feeling and then you see someone normal and they really stand out. Do the “snowflakes” get more attention sometimes because of this? Or not really at all and you might as well get some work done?

  72. Renee

    It really saddens me just much stress they put on physical appearance.
    In a society like that, how could you trust (assuming you’d had surgery) that the people in your life truly loved you for you?

  73. I don’t know if you misunderstood the definition of “plastic”, in “plastic surgery”. It doesn’t refer to the material, but it’s actually the adjective that means:
    -capable of being moulded or formed
    -of or relating to moulding or modelling: the plastic arts
    So it’s definitely not pejorative.

    But I guess you knew that because you’re both english teacher, I’m just saying!

  74. Korea has such a sick society. I could understand why so many Korean girls get plastic surgery. I don’t blame them. I think guys in Korea need to be changed(But I don’t think they will ever changed) They always criticise and degrade Korean women. If you could speak or understand little bit of Korean, you can easily find out how many Korean guys call their country women as “Kimchi girl” or “Soybean Girl” (fyi Japanese women= Sushi Girl, White women= White horse/yankee b***ch, Black women= Black horse)and always comparing Korean women with White women. Comparing with White women, they degrade Korean women’s appearance, skin colour, hair colour, eye colour, height, leg length, breast size and body shape(Most of the time, they get just White fashion/Victoria’s Secret model and celebrity photos and praise their looks and denigrate Korean women’s look, like how they are ugly and have awful body shape and how Asian women can’t be helped) If you have Korean girl friends just ask them about this. They will tell you, and you will realise those are much true. They humiliate Korean women too excessively not only Korean women but also every Asian women. I’ve seen so many articles and swearings which degrade Asian women. Korean men are also Asian, why they degrade Asian race? They just loathe all women except White women. Because Korean women love money? Well, maybe yeah, there are snobs in Korea but every country has snobs and gold diggers. But I just can’t accept and understand this level of insult. To me, it looks too too much. They also think having White girlfriend/wife as the ascent of status, men call him winner. Ha!!! If you have South-East Asian girlfriend/wife you are a loser because they have dark skin, hair and brown eyes. No wonder why Korean women get plastic surgery and want white skin. Crazy society.

    • I would have to disagree with you.
      I have many Korean friends and none of them feel this way.
      It’s true some Korean men (particularly men from the older generation) do look down on women. This is because of Korea’s Confucius culture and really, inequality between genders happens everywhere in the world. Not only Korea.

      You may have an opinion based on a experience but you can not pin that opinion down on ALL people without knowing them first. Do you know ALL the men of Korea? Have you interviewed every single one to conclude that everyone thinks this way? I don’t think so, because I certainly know a few that don’t ever think that way or insult anyone like you have described.

      I’ve been to Korea several times, I watch Korean dramas, know many Korean people and have never ever got that impression from them. Next time, do your research properly and get your facts straight before you base such an opinion on a culture. If anyone is racist here, it sure certainly is you.

  75. +1000 on this TL;DR. especially on the minzy case. i hope ppl don’t get me wrong, i love 2NE1 and i love Minzy, but it honestly disappointed me so much. she was absolutely 100% adorable and perefect just the way she was and… now… great. now she just… idk… i… don’t even know where to begin with and how to word my feelings. (and ppl trying to say “oh but she looks so much more happy and confident now !!”… as if Minzy ever looked unconfident and unhappy ???). another ps that made me sad and disappointed me a lot was Block b’s Kyung. damn it. he had an unique charming face that i liked a lot and then he just shaved his jaw/chin whatever and urgh, i was SO upset.
    anyway. by now i try to avoid the topic of PS really because it really gets no end and i could rant forever and it just brings me down and depresses me so much. one thing for sure, i’ve never been so anti-ps as i’ve never been before i got into kpop. and we would think that by now, i would have gotten used to it, uh, it’s such a commun thing, all my faves probably all got ps, but i realize that i can’t get used to it and i probably never will.

    • Blueberries

      I’m quite sad over Minzy’s PS as well. People say that’s it’s her body and her choice.. well yes but as someone who admired her unique looks, she just looks different like now and I have hard time to adapt to it ^^; I think she had really adorable nose before and now it’s quite regular one.

      I’m quite anti-PS too. I guess one of reason is that I like unique facial features and I tend to like on looks which are considered ugly in Korea. So when idols get a PS they kinda change the features that I liked most, sigh. Also I don’t think it’s good to be so appearance oriented, it just increases pressures to look “perfect” for everyone and like you can’t be happy with your own looks.

  76. About Minzy, from what I gathered, she actually said that she just took the opportunity to get plastic surgery on her nose at the same time as her rhinitis surgery. So I don’t think she’s using the rhinitis as a coverup, but rather admitting that she got it done at the same time. That said, I agree with you that it’s her choice to do whatever with her nose and I don’t judge, but I think there was absolutely no need for her to change her nose. She was beautiful before as well.

  77. I thought Minzy said that she had nose surgery for rhinitis and also had cosmetic surgery. Her mom was the one who suggested the cosmetic surgery, according to an article.

  78. I was also upset by Minzy’s surgery. Since she debuted in 2ne1 she didn’t look like she’d had any plastic surgery and I admired her for being confident with her looks. But then all of a sudden, years after, she suddenly gets this nose job, looks completely different, and then doesn’t tell the truth about why she got it. That’s not sending a good message to her young fans. She’s an idol, and idols are people that others look up to. I don’t intend to sound mean, it’s just this has been on my mind since I first heard of it, and I tried not to talk about it before, but I honestly just feel like I want to voice my opinion on it.

  79. Plastic surgery makes me sad. I am in the same head space as Simon and Martina about it. I think its socially wrong for people to be expected to spend so much money and time on trying to become more “ideal” looking when the person probably would be more attractive just by being more confident, putting on some nice clothes and a little make-up. Frankly, from my own perspective its almost insulting that people want to change such little things that they think make them more appealing to the world. Aren’t we all encouraged to not care about what other people think of us? I mean if we run around all day worrying about what other people think our lives are plagued with negative ways of thinking and feeling. From personal experience I can say that I suffer from my own body image, but not because I’m over weight or I have big earlobes or a larger nose than I’d like, but because I’m Transgender. I’m of the opinion that plastic surgeon Doctors should focus more on the types of surgery that people do actually need in order to have a properly functioning body and mind. Sure some might consider me reforming my breasts into a male chest to be a purely aesthetic surgery, but if I had a chance to talk to those people I would explain at great length that my want and need for surgery is on a much greater need basis than a nose job. I promote self confidence and positivity to people who think they have an ugly face and try to remind other people who may have been born “pretty” that what really matters at the end of the day is not what your face like but who you are as a person. Its pretty simple logic! If you are a shitty person but have a pretty face people will not want to be around you, because you are a shitty person lol.
    I especially make a point of arguing with people when they talk about the things they don’t like about their body, and I remind them that they are lucky, because being who I am I suffer daily on account of the fact that my body image doesn’t match with how I feel on the inside. Which is the complete opposite of feeling shitty about your body because of what other people say.
    I try to not be hypocritical when it comes to this, but who can really help being hypocritical once in a while? More so, I just hate to see beautiful people who are sad because other people tell them they aren’t beautiful. My own body issues are more than just looking nice. Its about being able to chose whether or not you yourself need something based on your own feelings of yourself. Not anyone else’s.

  80. Big noses on guys are pretty sexy. So manly.

  81. In Malaysia its normal to have your photo on your resume too~

  82. You should do an updated apartment tour. To show whats different since you now film at the studio! :)

  83. In my country, Indonesia, it’s a normal thing to have your photo on your resume, so when you brought that up, I was a little bit confused.

  84. Honestly, I agree with you about Minzy and her surgery. I had no idea she even had surgery until I saw your video and read your blog post. It’s just sad that she felt the need to change her nose when we loved her exactly the way she was. I’ve always really appreciated that Minzy was someone in the Kpop industry that didn’t seem to conform to the sometimes ridiculous “ideal” Korean woman. She’s just an incredibly talented girl and it’s sad that she felt the need to change some part of her face. I mean, I don’t know if the rhinitis story is legitimate, but I’m pretty sure that even if she required surgery for it, the surgery wouldn’t require changes to the whole nose structure. We do have to remember that she’s still very young and I don’t blame her for having insecurities but it just makes me a little bit sad.

  85. On the back of the topic of PS, would you guys be able to discuss the issue of body image in Korea? Although I understand that obviously not everyone in Korea cares about Kpop, it must be hard for (especially the younger and more impressionable) population to ignore discourse on weight and shape when many idols openly discuss their diets etc as well as the extreme emphasis placed on appearance in wider Korean society. Are eating disorders common as well? Thanks x

  86. I AM GLAD THAT YOU FINALLY DID THIS TOPIC! in regards to minji’s ps, i understand what you are saying and your opinion. for me, i am just proud of her for ADMITTING to getting p.s. in the first place. many kpop idols deny it or dont say anything (park bom). i think she say part of reason for rhinitis and part of it was to look more pretty.

  87. I had watched one tv show before, where japanese and korean argued about plastic surgery, japanese said it’s okay to have ugly face or just ordinary while korean said your face should be fixed! It’s because you have sin that you are ugly! (don’t kill me guys, I really watched this tv show somewhere in youtube). I couldn’t even know what am I supposed to say, but I really hope not all people in korea really obsessed with that “temporary beauty”.

  88. -in reference to the image/meme below- so apparently there was a case like this. a couple had a baby, but the baby looked batshit ugly. so the dada was like, bitch are you cheating on me? then the mama ended up confessing to 100k worth of PS (evidently the chicky didnt tell him beforehand). to which the dada responded with a divorce and a law suit.. and won.

  89. I just wanted to mention, I believe I read about the Minzy getting plastic surgery ordeal! Apparently, she did actually admit that she had plastic surgery, but she didn’t say that it was for her rhinitis. She was apparently just having her rhinitis treated by getting her nose bone straightened, but decided to get a nose job while she was at it, just because she wanted to kill 2 birds with one stone or something. She did admit that she had a nose job just because she wanted to!

  90. Reminds me of this episode of the twilight zone:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Y2ml24bc78

    Freaky stuff.

  91. welllll… dis how i be feelin’ bout all of dis…

    http://youtu.be/264nb9wX0Qo

  92. i agree, i think everyone is starting to have the same eyes, same nose, same face shape.. it’s really unnerving and not attractive at all. ):

  93. I think having plastic surgery is okay but overdoing it would be kinda freaky. I appreciate recognising people by their unique features (when I was in korea every woman looked almost the same to me, except some ajummas there). Even from a professional perspective (medical, if you may), going under the knife is still regarded as SURGERY. That means you’re at the risk of dying in the operating theatre or screwing up. Every surgery has its risk of failing. In Singapore, a CEO of a company died during liposuction. I was initially pretty okay with getting plastic surgery, but after that, I know I wasn’t ready enough to take the risks. I’m not going to entertain the idea of possibly losing my life in exchange for lifelong beauty.

    As for employment and plastic surgery, it’s going to hurt both sides if that’s how they judge someone. The rejected candidate, for not getting a jobx and the employer, for losing someone who was perhaps more capable than the chosen (and hypothetically speaking, the prettier one) candidate. Either way, it’s a shallow way of judging someone.

    I do understand the beauty standards in Korea (I suspect they do come from manhwa/anime), but I’ll never understand the urge of certain Korean women to want to achieve that look. I’ve seen so many girls with the gangnam unnie look that I don’t even think it’s pretty at all. It comes as cross as unnatural and uncomfortable to the eye (an irony, considering people get surgery to look pretty).

    What’s worse, if a dude dates me, I think I’ve gotta start wondering if he’s dating me for my looks or for the real me. It’s gonna make me so much more insecure. Sure not all guys date girls for their body/ looks, but many do.

    I’m ugly and I do get taunted for being bulky physically, but to hell with those haters. But if I were given the chance to do me nose or jaws… I’ll never do it.

  94. I went to college whose student population had a large number of Koreans, both Americans, immigrants, and exchange students. I had been unaware of Korea’s beauty standard but I apparently fit a lot of them – big eyes with double lids, small face, v line etc. The #1 most common compliment I got was about how big my eyes were. The #2 was “You look just like a Korean!” Now I saw my fair share of Koreans and I have to say, most of them were not even close to fitting the beauty standards perpetuated by the media. So when I asked people to elaborate, they said “You look like a Korean after plastic surgery!”. Honestly, I’m not sure how to feel about that.

  95. in 6:32 my facebook friend is in the picture you know and she didnt even hava surgery you know you should feel really bad about yourself cause you know nothing about her and your saying that shes a plastic surgery freak? shes really mad about this and her friend and her fans. get some manners did you even get permission to post her picture in that video? What i really think is if you dont like something about yourself you should change it because you love yourself whats wrong with getting prettier? whats her fault? she didnt do anyything and she woke up this morning and realized shes in this video about plastic surgeryy freak really? how would you feel if this happened to you huh? did you even think about her feelings? and i’m pretty sure that shes going to do something about this

  96. I’m kind of mad about this you know in 6:32 in those pictures 1,3 is my facebook friend you know and shes really mad about this i mean how would you feel if your called plastic surgery freak. I think if you dont feel beautiful about yourself then you can change it because you love yourself you know. you should delete this video or somethin cause this is very offensive to her in many ways

  97. I wanna see Simon stick his thumb up his nose!

  98. kawaii_candie

    very interesting TL;DR! i think that if i was going to have plastic surgery, i would definitely go to korea! I live in Japan and actually a lot of people here do go to go Korea for plastic surgery! plus, medicine is so terrible in Japan, i’d honestly be scared to get anything done here…

    i do think it’s sad though, the pushing of young girls to get surgery, and the fact that it’s even related to getting a job… it really shouldn’t, and that’s really stupid… (although in Japan, you also have to attatch a photo to your resume!)

    on a side note though, have you guys ever read the books “Uglies” and “Pretties”? when i see the pictures of all those korean girls who look like dolls with big giant eyes, i imagine that’s what Pretties look like!! XD

  99. Everything has it’s own positive and negative. When you first get plastic surgery, you may be really happy with your look for about like 10 years. After that, you have to keep getting plastic surgery because not everything last forever, and your face gonna look really unnatural. So I think the one who did plastic surgery know what they got into.

  100. I would say plastic surgery is a form of violence towards men and women inflicted by society… sad, but no society is perfect.

  101. I think it’s unfair that when applying for things I often have to include aptitude test scores or take a personality test but can’t send a picture. We all have different strengths.

  102. about this rhinitis thing, yes, the shape of your nose affect your rhinitis, my sister had to make a plastic because of this, she couldn’t breath well and made it, now she is much better, of course in the process she gave a little touch, doctors do this, if you have a problem in your nose they already fix it a little in the process if you want lol so I think it depends of the type she had of rhinitis so yes, it can affect (but I don’t think she made the plastic because of this)

    edit: can you make a tl;dr about how are psychological treatments like psychiatrists seen in Korea? I heard that ff you have an history of medications and treatment you can lost the job vacancy, if so, I’m so screwed up lol

  103. Plastic surgery is totally unfair! It takes away a god-given advantage from handsome people. Handsome people can’t go out and get a little “IQ reformation surgery” if they feel insecure about their intellect. Handsome people rights! Keep ugly people ugly! #kidding

  104. What about non-invasive, temporary procedures like Botox and dermal fillers? Michelle Phan (who’s had Botox and chin fillers) said that, in a sense, they’re like makeup, because both are non-invasive and temporary. I’m thinking about getting nose fillers to smooth out my bridge because it’s not fair that my entire family has perfectly straight nose bridges while I’m sitting here with the top 1/3 of my nose bridge being unusually lower than the lower 2/3.

    • Michelle Phan at first lied and said she was all natural and even included a little preaching about how she believed in accepting yourself….and then admitted to getting botox and fillers and defended them. I don’t mind if she got work done but that was a really big cop out.

  105. One of my friends, who was a student from Korea studying in the States, had totally received double eyelid surgery as a graduation gift. She didn’t get it, but did get permanent eyeliner tattooed on instead. (It was supposed to give the same look without being surgery. I didn’t see it though.)

    And I also noticed that, even in English, she didn’t call it cosmetic surgery. She called it working on her face or something like that? I said Americans would call that cosmetic surgery (or incorrectly, plastic surgery), and she insisted it wasn’t the same, because the surgery wasn’t as severe.

    Speaking of, kinda surprised that you two called out the difference in language from plastic surgery to reforming surgery, but still incorrectly referred to cosmetic surgery as plastic surgery. :P

  106. I mean, in Canada (at least, where I live, I don’t know about every single part of Canada!), you are not supposed to give a picture of yourself when you hand out a résumé! You are not even supposed to say how old you are to avoid discrimination!
    What a pressure it must be on South Koreans…
    And Simon, a good looking boy and a good looking girl will have cute kids. Though they wont look like their parents at all!

  107. My monolids have been a complex for me since I was young due to a simple sentence from my cousin. ‘I hate how my eyes are so small. It’s because I have monolids. I’m gonna get them done when I’m older. Don’t you hate yours too?’ And just like that I learnt of the existence of these apparently horrible things called monolids. And from then on I spent my teenage years hating my ‘small’ eyes and thinking of ways to make them ‘bigger’. I was so annoyed seeing youtube makeup tutorials and seeing how I couldn’t achieve their look because of my eye shape. But I always feared getting any surgery done because I’m dead scared of pointy things and the fact that they were cutting and ‘reconstructing’ me while I was asleep was enough to stop me from even asking for permission. In retrospect, I’m so glad I did though, because over the years I’ve learned to accept the way I am and the way I look (although from time to time I still become self-conscious, I am a human being after all :P), learned to do makeup the way I like and accentuates features I want to accentuate including my eye shape that I loathed so much when I was younger (I’ve been complimented for my makeup before which was a nice little bonus for getting over a complex ;D).
    Sorry for the long read! But seeing this article really made me want to share some things.

    TL;DR: a story of monolid-ed Korean girl learning the cliche lesson of accepting herself as she is ;)

    • Monolidders totally rock the winged and smoky look! :D I have a friend who has large double fold so her eyes are big but not much lid for her to do her make up on so she’s pretty jealous of me and now you! Since we have monolids. =D

    • As someone who has tapered lids, you dunno how jealous I am of monolids. I have double eyelids but the crease is so folded, any makeup I put on is immediately swallowed up. There’s makeup tutorials for monolids and double lids but tapered lids are that awkward in between look that you can’t figure out. =___=;;

      • lindaar(*°▽°*)ノ♪

        Oh my god, as a fellow tapered-lidder, I totally feel you! I can only admire youtube makeup tutorials from afar bc getting looks to work on my eyes can be such a nightmare! (Youtuber: “Now apply the peachy shadow onto your crease to add dimension to the eye” me: “ok bye bye eyeshadow, see you when my eyes are closed”) For me, makeup tutorials are more eye candy and appreciating other people’s beauty + talent in applying makeup + fabulousness, rather than something I can do for myself. Sometimes I wonder why I even bother w applying eyeshadow to the folded up part.. people with tapered eyelids should just skip the middle (saves makeup and in effect, money!).

        We should totally start a new trend ;)))))
        But nah, I’m that person that gets irked by people who haven’t penciled in their upper waterline THE LOOK ISN’T COMPLETE!!!!!!!11!1 I CAN SEE YOUR SKIN FROM UNDERNEATH YOUR WINGED LINER NOOOOOO
        Ok, I digress. Let us embrace our tapered eyelids, hope for more tapered-lidders on youtube, or start making our own makeup channel after figuring these babies out!

      • Mine swallows my eye shadows all the time, especially at the inner corner. Just nomming away. lol. So I just focus on the outer edge of my eye by either elongating the line with a liquid or gel liner or making the eye shadow gradually thicker towards the end (in addition to drawing an elongated line, I think it really helps accentuates the eye). Obviously neither of us know what each other looks like so I can’t say for sure if this will help (or if it even made any sense :s), but that’s what I do when my eye wants to nom away like there is no tomorrow. ;D

      • THIS i can relate to.

    • It’s funny that you mentioned makeup tutorials because my problem it’s kinda the opposite XD I’m a westerner and I’ve been trying japanese makeup tutorial for years, and I get super frustrated because yeah, it looks “okay” on me but not as good as the girl in the video because damn, my eyes are too western for these techniques! LOL So yeah, it also happens the other way around XD I guess we are never satisfied with what we have? I like my eyes but I find monolids really beautiful too.

  108. 8:05 WAS SO ADORABLE HOW SIMON DOESN’T GIVE A SHIT ANYMORE BC THE ONLY PERSON WHO MATTERS LOVES IT. tooooo cute xD

    ahem anyways.

    I’m a korean born and raised in the US and I abhor this whole plastic surgery obsession. The requirement for a picture on resumes and the rewards thing for students makes me sick.

  109. Personally, I don’t think getting plastic surgery is that big of a deal because it’s your body so it’s only you who should decide what you want to do with it. There’s no harm in cosmetic surgery and if it’s going to affect you positively like boost your self esteem then go ahead. But I do agree that it shouldn’t be strongly encouraged but it is an option that’s there.
    (btw, my dream career is becoming a plastic surgeon)

  110. Caitlin Martina Byrnes
    Caitlin Martina Byrnes

    I just want to say it’s sort of sad seeing all these comments about how “guys don’t like girls who get lots of plastic surgery.” Who’s to say a person gets plastic surgery for a sexual reason like that? A lot of the people I hear about who get plastic surgery in Korea get it for jobs or because there is a part of their body they’re dissatisfied with. And in my opinion, a guy saying a girl is unattractive because of plastic surgery is the same to me as a guy saying a girl is unattractive for any other reason. I think a lot of us are also speaking from our own cultural contexts, we should remember that plastic surgery is totally normal in south korea. To me it’s the same as piercings in North America, a lot of times I’ll see girls really young, under the age of ten with their ears pierced. I personally think that’s too young, but that’s my own opinion coming from my own experiences and cultural context. It’s easy to judge something when it comes from another country.

  111. Simon and Martina, I’m disappointed too that Minzy got surgery, but I
    don’t think it’s BS. She said she was going to get the surgery for
    health reasons, but then her mother told her that while she’s at it she
    might as well get a nose job. Apparently the head of YG agreed. So it’s
    not like she really wanted the surgery and took the initiative to get
    it, she was being convinced by people who are important to her and have
    a lot of influence over her.

    • No, they are saying that the reason she gave at first “I got a surgery for health problems and it changed my nose” is BS, not the fact that she got a surgery (though they are disappointed about it) . We all know that agencies and idols find pretty BS excuses to explain the sudden change on their face (getting older, lost baby fat, etc.)!

      • They should have just waited for Minzy to say something. Then it wouldn’t come off as being so dishonest. If Minzy wanted to do it and she’s happy with the results, that’s fine. But either don’t mention it at all or be honest about it.

    • It’s just a teeny bit harder to believe even a completely plausible explanation when it’s preceded by a blatant and apparent lie. Remember: they first denied she had surgery and said she just got more beautiful now that she’s older. Because aging a little bit totally alters your basic bone structure. >.>

      So I can’t blame people for calling BS or feeling disappointed when they’re being fed, well, BS.

      • Yeah I think YG wanted to deny it but Minzy didn’t like that so she admitted it. It sucks though cause I feel like she was pressured into it and I’m glad that she had the integrity to admit she had a nose job but it sucks that those around her wanted her to get it AND wanted to deny it afterwards.

  112. I have monolids, growing up I was ALWAYS reminded by family that I had them. I grew up in California but the thing is my cousin has monolids too but he NEVER was reminded of it. So unfair, so it really is still the whole doll/western look. But I have always hated that I got told all the time ‘You’re not pretty, eyes too small, too skinny, too dark skinned.’ Well my answer was well since you hate it so much I’ll LOVE IT! Haha so yeah I am totally against the double lid surgery for myself go suck on that in-law aunts! In conclusion with many other things in my life ‘If it isn’t broken why fix it?’

  113. It’s not that I’m for plastic surgery at all, but what I feel is as long as you don’t completely change the way you really look then fine. If you have the money to pay for a double eyelid, jaw, or nose surgery then great. But overdoing and continuing to do it is the problem. What I don’t really like is that you see a person’s old pictures and see that he or she looks like a completely different person now. What I also don’t like is that person doing surgery because of peer pressure or pressure from family and relatives, that person should be able to make his or her own decision to do it and not be forced to for whatever reason. So I wouldn’t really judge someone who had a minor few things done as say that person is fake, because if it’s what they wanted you can’t really do anything about it.

  114. My experience has been the opposite. I was never bothered by plastic surgery until I was introduced to K-pop. Now I have come to dislike it very much. Smashing up the human body with tools – that’s what it is, even if you are under anesthesia, even if it’ll make you look more beautiful (what does that even mean?), even if it makes you more confident (does it actually?). Looking appealing is part of a celebrity’s job – that’s their way of grabbing your attention, so I can understand to some extent. Celebrities everywhere do it. But I don’t see why your regular non-celeb person has to do it. It just makes me angry when healthy people put their bodies under stress for non-medical reasons. Maybe I’m the one who is crazy. Anyway, I think the biggest problem is when people (friends or family especially) force these ideals onto others.

  115. What I will say is that Rhinitis can call for surgery if breathing becomes a major problem due to the bridge of the nose being slightly to the right or left instead of aligned in the middle. I have the issue to some extent, and a doctor actually recommended that I get surgery for it if the problem gets worse. I honestly don’t believe this is the case with Minzy though… She seems like she’s gotten quite a bit of surgery so her nose being a cosmetic want rather than a medical need. But I can only agree to plastic surgery being an enhancement to some extent. A nose job or eyelid surgery is one thing, but shaving down your jawline for face reconstruction…

  116. Molly

    One of my professors here in Kentucky told us that she had a student whose parents got her breast implant surgery for her high school graduation present(!) and it made her feel really bad about her breasts, and how her parents thought of her.

  117. Amyaco

    Holla at that Sapir-Whorf hypothesis! :P

  118. not all asians have monolids, my mom and sister both have double eyelids while only me in the family has monolids

    • It’s a weird ratio for who doesn’t and who gets the monolids. Both my parents have double, and so do my two sisters, it’s just me. :P (high-five) Monolid club!

      • My dad has inner double eyelids (the ones that show only on the outer edge of your eye for those who are confused), my sister has outer double eyelid (the so-called regular ones), and my mom and I have monolids. I definitely don’t know of the ratio, but good to know there’s others like that ;D

    • My korean friend has one double and one single. He also has wavy hair on one side and straight on the other, but he keeps it short so you can’t tell. He always says if he showed one side of his face, then the other it would be two different people.

    • Agreed, most of my family have double eyelids. My brother has one single and one double, though when he’s sleepy the fold gets deeper and it looks like he has two double eyelids. It’s not uncommon for Asians to have “natural” double eyelids at all.

  119. Some of my female friends (USA) have gotten breast reductions because it was just too painful and causing major back problems. And reconstructive surgery after trauma.
    Plastic Surgery isn’t just for vain superficial reasons, sometimes(a lot of the time) it helps people live a normal life that they wouldn’t be able to have otherwise.

  120. Not to be too creepy. But anybody who disagrees with why Martina won a certain contest that Simon (I assume) posted a link to on twitter recently should check out the old 4 minute music monday linked in this blogpost.

    Smooooooking!

  121. I have never had a problem with plastic surgery – it’s your body, if it’s your free will you can do anything with it…even do that weird donut forehead thingy (don’t know how it’s called) if it makes you happy. The annoying thing is that it’s common for Koreans to be forced into insecurities by close people through their lives – like relatives and family, not some jerks during school who simply need someone to bully, which I think is most common way for people to become insecure.
    Also I agree to Simon and Martina – being good looking is a bonus, not the main quality(unless you are going for a position for some businessman’s secretary) , at least where I am from . In my opinion it has more to do with confidence, beautiful people tend to be more confident and sure of themselves. If I had to choose between two people with the same qualifications for some important position I would definitely choose the confident (confident, not totally vain and self-obsessed) person over the insecure one.
    Also I think that public people have more pressure to be good looking, but it’s very generalized. like, good figure, hair, skin and fashion, not – eyes have to be at this angle, jaw line like this, cheekbones here….

  122. It’s pretty sad :/ (my opinion dkm xp)
    I know it’s their own body and can do what you want with it, i get that but i reallyy do think everyone has their own type of look that they like and if everyone got surgery to look like everyone else, you’ll never find that awkward/unique look that you love d: or find someone who loves your awkward/unique look.
    The look i like in guys is considered kind of weird to some of my friends but I just really like it xP It’s my taste d: I don’t think too much about it but other day my friends wanted to know what my type was and i didn’t really find any of the dudes they showed me attractive, & tried showing them some too and it was same, didn’t like the look i liked, they have their own taste, but if all those guys that were my type got surgery that would suck :/
    there’s always going to be people who think your ugly or just not that great but then their will also be people who think you look amazing (: and if society gets to use to this ..surgery thing , that will be harder to come by :/
    and if you tried to look perfect it would just get freaky x.x it might make you feel nice having everyone like the way you look but … there’s probably a ton of negative side effects to that.

  123. So what do people do if they have “darker” skin? Put on lots of makeup? Is there surgery?

    To be honest though, as someone who has fair skin (when not exposed to a lot of sun LOLOLOLOLOL), I really don’t notice “dark” skin as something different. Like S+M’s whole nose thing. It literally should not be a thing.. Although, yes I totally get that fair/soft skin used to be a sign of luxury and status because otherwise you worked in the fields and naturally would then develop darker/rougher skin. I feel like this isn’t what Koreans are talking about when they admire fair skin.
    (And I say Koreans, because I think the country is small and developed enough to the point where “darker” skinned people are worried about distinguishing themselves from those working in the provinces/fields)

    • Do not underestimate the origin of such things, my friend. Culture is a beast that lives long and struggles through reform.

    • Koreans concerned about dark pigmentation or skin tone usually try a variety of topical lightening agents and products in their skin care regiment. At skin clinics they will do treatments of laser skin toning and possibly take what is known as the “White Gem Injection” or what many locals call “Beyonce Injection.” These are weekly IV injections of an anti-oxidant called Glutathione. It’s actually very good for your health, but it has an interesting side effect. It lightens your skin and improves the health and texture of it, but once you stop taking it, your skin color will come back, especially if you have a lot of sun exposure.

    • For a cheaper solution people use whitening creams, some kinda work some just kill your skin. My aunt has used some and now she has really bad skin since creams don’t go on evenly. So REALLY don’t recommend going the cheap route if someone decides to lighten their skin.
      It’s sad though for those who aren’t exposed to sunlight or hiding under layers of clothes and an umbrella when they go out, they’re missing out on Vitamin D which they need.

    • I remember Tyra Banks did a segment on skin whitening in the black community and a lot of women used bleaching creams that stung and some even resorted to using straight up bleach. But their reason for wanting lighter skin might not be completely why Koreans want it. I’m Chinese and I can honestly say light skin was never about westernization (because people like the pale dolly look instead of thick, red skin) – my mom always says I look like a peasant or a southerner if I tan.

  124. Ahh, the infamous rhinitis story returns. Coughyesungandjaejoongcough.

  125. Personally, I hate plastic surgery. :( It feels like such a lie and denial. I respect peoples’ freedom to do it, but it doesn’t mean I have to like it. My friend, we’ll call Juney, is from Korea and she’s had plastic surgery before. She looks beautiful but I can see what it’s done to her–both before and after. Before she got it, she didn’t think herself beautiful at all, even though she was! She thought her eyes were too “Asian” (her words, not mine) and her lips were too thin.

    So, she got plastic surgery and “fixed” those “problems”. She still doesn’t have any confidence. I’m concerned that one day she might turn into a plastic surgery monster like Bom Park. :/ She strives for perfection, which is a horrible goal to set for yourself. Juney actually hurt my feelings a few weeks ago when she suggested I get surgery to fix my eyes. I’m from Sweden and have your typical Swedish look (blonde hair, blue eyes, sharp features), minus my eyes. They’re pretty big, but the thing she thinks needs to be fixed is the fact I have monolids. Saying that to me was really offensive since I LOVE it. I’m not Asian, though–I get it from my Sami blood. So hearing a friend tell me that I’m more or less ugly was just…ouch. She never said shit like that beforehand.

    The worst part is I can see that trend affecting Sweden as well. People say Swedish girls are the prettiest in the world, and hey I won’t deny that! ;D Buuuut…I don’t know a single person here who has any ounce of confidence in themselves. Dare I say having any sort of confidence is considered bad in Sweden. The stigma is to be as humble as possible, even if it causes negative effects to your self esteem. Plastic surgery has never been common here whatsoever, and has the same negative connotations as in America. But even so, once in a while I’ll see some girl who has that…/look/ to her. That you can’t place your finger on it but you know something, somewhere, there was work done. It breaks my heart.

    Ladies (and men!), your face is your’s to own. Do with what you like, but please don’t ruin what you already have too much! Try getting confidence before resorting to PS.

    (P.S. sorry if my English is bad! I’m a bit rusty, so if there’s spelling mistakes or grammatical errors, I sincerely apologize.)

  126. Pretty sure Minzy said that because she is getting a rhinitis surgery she decided to also do a rhinoplasty. She never said it was just a rhinitis surgery.

  127. I think that it is funny that it is more accepted in South Korea, yet they always ask idols if they got plastic surgery or not. Like why do they care if its not a big deal and nearly everyone is getting it? I’m okay if people want to get plastic surgery. To me its your own decision and I can tell that you want to more pretty and I appreciate the effort. (I would never get it. It’s scary :’( ) But, I think having it being so accepted makes people think that they aren’t as pretty as some stupid ideal which only a feel people are or ca get to. Plastic Surgery for like mole and scars and other medical stuff, I totally get.

    It reminds me of that lawsuit in China. This lady got plastic surgery, married a handsome guy, and had “ugly” kids. Her husband sued her for having an affair and when it was proved that they were biologically his kids a year later he sued her for having lied to him about having plastic surgery. It’s just ridiculous. First, he is a horrible person for thinking all three of his kids are ugly and suing his wife over it. Second, why can’t you think that they are pretty the way they are? Third, if she hadn’t completely changed her face she wouldn’t have had this problem to begin with.

    Anyways, I realize that here in the US we can be more accepting, and in South Korea they can stop being SO accepting. -Sigh- Such a fine line. :)

  128. There’s this book “Uglies” and it’s about a society that makes EVERYONE get a plastic surgery at a certain age to make them all conveniently beautiful. It’s scary how close to that Korea already is :/

  129. jongup from B.A.P said a person told him he would lose his charm if he had surgery so i like to think not all koreans encourage it :) but i do reckon there is more pressure for girls which sucks.

  130. Chloe

    p.p.s. Super offended by swamp donkey comment. Donkeys are adorable. Swamps are awesome. Logic says a swamp donkey would be adorable and awesome. End of story.

  131. Chloe

    Did I just lose my long-ass comment I carefully crafted because I forgot to sign in? FUDGE.

    I guess I’ll just summarize. I have a hard time putting aside my North American bias regarding South Korea and plastic surgery. While I appreciate the more open acknowledgment of it in S.K. vs. the secrecy and hypocritical shaming found in U.S(where I’m writing from), I can’t accept that parents have to encourage plastic surgery for their children just so they can have a chance of success. I think eventually they will need a change of attitude. Most societies need a change of attitude regarding beauty. I feel I have a right to be as ‘ugly’ as I want, because my pimples, un-toned flabbiness and under-eye bags don’t effect my ability to think, work, learn, communicate, or feel, unless I let my insecurities dominate me and my decisions. Those other qualities should define a person, not the subjective and often changing hive-minded opinion of attractiveness. Plus, plastic surgery is surgery: even the most minor ones involve cutting, injecting, implanting of foreign materials, etc. And it isn’t free. That’s a lot to ask of a person just to get a job.
    p.s. I thought Minzy was so beautiful before :( especially her nose, I loved her nose. She still is, but she didn’t need to do anything! Nobody needs to do anything!

  132. I assume European is also Western Culture? In Germany you don’t call it plastic surgery. We call it something like beauty surgery or cosmetic surgery. In France it’s also often called aesthetic surgery. So your “plastic” (as in fake, cheap, barbie etc.) argument might really just apply to English speaking countries? Doesn’t mean that “beauty surgery” has a particularly positive connotation for me^^

    • Blueberries

      It’s called “beaty surgery” in my country too (Finland). But it doesn’t have positive ring to it either. It’s really rare in my country to get plastic surgery, mostly people get bigger boobs, other beaty surgeries are really uncommon. So it’s mostly about sex appeal, not about getting job or even looking pretty.

  133. Carolynn

    I personally would never get plastic surgery. I love the way I am even through I have a crooked nose! It’s unique, and you can hardly tell it is crooked, not that it matters. When I was in high school it used to bother me a ton, but now that I’m out of college and married I really don’t care. I am also a size USA 14, that is considered large here but it does not bother me. I love myself don’t want to compare myself to others. I want to enjoy life and not obsess over how I look or how other people see me. Life is to short to try and keep myself as beautiful as possible, there are too many things to see and do and experience!

    Martina you are so beautiful! One of the things I look forward to in every new video is “what will Martina be wearing? What new adorable way will she style her hair? how creative will she be with her eyeshadow?!” You are just amazing and so creative with your wardrobe and you inspire me! I can’t wait to get my hat in the mail with my prince Meemers pin!! :D

  134. random but even the anchor woman in the news clip was a typical beauty :P

  135. Having A photo with your CV is very common in Asian countries

  136. honestly, i was very upset and didn’t want to believe that Minzy went under the knife !!! but what shocked me more is when the story was revealed stating that her mom suggested it! how messed up it is to have the closest person to you telling you you need to change a feature of your face and lose more weight to be beautiful, i strongly believe that a om’s job is to boost your self confidence as a parent sees his child beautiful no matter what. As you said the message Minzy transmits to high-shoolers and teenage fans is that being talented is not enough (you need to be pretty), i had so much respect for her for being different that’s what made her special. now the only hope i got left is that CL will never never undergo surgery and keep embracing her natural looks.

  137. I think plastic surgery is all right if done in moderation. Like removing a double chin when you hit 60 for instance. And in the US its not uncommon to get jaw surgery to correct your jaw alignment, or braces, though in the US its not considered plastic surgery since its for health reasons (although looking nice is a positive side effect).

    I can see where someone might want to straighten a crooked nose, but getting your nose, eyes, chin done? It seems a bit much. I think perhaps part of the reason has to do with Korea’s standard of beauty.

    You mentioned it in a different video: the standard is a small face, big eyes, etc. I think that’s the reason all the girls were looking the same, because they wanted to fit that standard of beauty. I hope this changes one day. If people viewed more than one type of face as beautiful, I don’t think people would feel pressured for quite so much surgery. I for one find monolids really sexy. ;)

  138. Hey guise, just in defence of Minzy. Her post said that she was getting surgery for rhinitis, but as this involved her getting surgery anyway, her Mom (and this really disturbed me, for your own mother to suggest it!!) suggested she also get a nose job as her nose would be operated on anyway for the rhinitis, Minzy really deliberated on it and thought YG would say no to the procedure, but he was actually encouraging (again this disturbs me). Ultimately it was Minzy who made the decision but I upload her on her honesty. She says in the statement that she doesn’t like to full people and that is why she came out to contradict the YG rep.

  139. Well, I understand begin judge as an ugly girl in the school life.. Because I was the ugliest in my school, and all the boy just keep bullied me whenever the class start or end.. I hate my self that time, why I was so ugly.. but well, now I had grown up.. I had change a lot, I didn’t get a surgery, but I manage to make my own self with dying my hair and wear lens even do some make up. I hope at there know some other way to change them self. Like “That’s your special way, That’s you” thought in their mind. People won’t earn anything from becoming a goose. And trust it a duck can turn a goose not by taking a ‘force’ way, but step by step. The God know the ‘best’ on you. Not by your look, maybe by your other ways? It’s just my opinion thought. *bow

  140. “Minzy afterwards contradicted that and said that, yes, she got a nose job, but only because she suffers from rhinitis or something.”

    no she didn’t, you guys misunderstood. This is exactly what she said: “My mom suggested that while I was getting Rhinitis correction, I should also get plastic surgery to make my nose prettier.”

    She clearly said the PS was for purely cosmetic reasons. It’s a separate operation from her Rhinitis correction

  141. Oh, come’on…… This whole thing is making me so anxious…. So everybody has to be “doll perect”??? How are we going to tell each other apart then??

    Plus, ok, I get it, you want to look better, and feel better and get a better job maybe… So you get surgery and you become Barbie, and then you decide to have kids. Who will forever assume that their faces are something to be ASHAMED of, untill they ALSO get surgery…. Is that what we want to teach our kids??? Really??
    I tottaly ship big noses!!!! <3

  142. andrea chan

    Funny story: I like to subway sketch and when I was in Korea for a year, I gave up the habit because I’d only ever draw the same nose or the same eyes over and over again. I think it was then when I realized just how common plastic surgery was in Korea… It’s a good thing to be back at home- I’ve never realized the variety I’ve taken for granted.

  143. Oh my~ Quite the topic you guys seem to have grappled here. I figured y’all would do something like this eventually and I’m glad, because I really do enjoy your opinions ^^ Anyway, I’m going to be blunt here; I do not like plastic surgery. I do not like it at all. I wouldn’t say that I’m against *other* people getting it because its their body, but if they ask my opinion, I’m going to be 100% with them. Obviously there are exceptions to the rule (health or body reconstructive purposes, for example) and I won’t condemn you, but once again, I’m not going to pull any punches (wow, I am making myself sound like a horrid friend XD). Quite honestly, if you can’t love yourself for what you look like naturally, then how is altering that supposed to make you feel better? And I’m not being sarcastic or rhetorical there, I am being very serious; that is a line of thought/logic that I cannot understand. I feel like getting plastic surgery is like putting on a mask that you can never take off. And what’s worse is the fact that you might have to get *more* work done to make sure the work you got done before stays looking nice. It just doesn’t seem to have any benefits to me. I’d rather stay looking the way I am and learn to deal with it (as in change what I can, and learn to love what I can’t), then get some procedure done and have to worry about it every single day of the rest of my life (and the thought of being addicted is even more scary Y_Y).

  144. Is this a Seoul based issue, or is it across the whole country? Id like to know if this is the way the whole nation thinks, or would it split the population into a ‘townie’ and ‘rural/country girl’ perception?

  145. bhahahahahah! Rhinitis is caused by either bacterial or viral infection. All the patient needed are prescribed antibiotics or antiviral drugs. No plastic nor collagen needed. Plus, I really don’t think those bacteria or viruses are capable of physically eating the nose structures which resulted in obstructed airway or that the excessive mucus secretion due to infection is fatally eternal.

  146. love my father that told me
    “you are more beautiful if you are healthy and happy”
    yeah, he believe that people is beautiful if they stay on shape normally cause not everyone can do that

    what a lovely father of mine, thanks for always saying that

  147. Endoscopic surgery on your nose to correct a crooked
    nose (deviated nasal septum ) or remove noncancerous (benign)
    nasal polyps. I found this on a website that said straightening your nose doesn’t cure Rhinitis but does help vastly with treatment of symptoms.

  148. I don’t really agree with PS because it’s inauthentic and it doesn’t really help most people in the long run. Since your PS looks aren’t your natural looks they’re superficial and you can’t pass them down to your children (e.g. your kids might not even resemble you at all o_0). You just bought your beauty so it’s not really that special and your PS face/body is more like a mask that hides what you truly look like. If I can’t be naturally/genetically beautiful then I don’t think PS can be completely satisfying.

    Also, if you were insecure before PS then there’s a pretty good chance that you’ll still be insecure with PS. Relying on you’re outward appearance as a source of confidence is doesn’t really help you develop self esteem from within. This is probably why people get addicted to PS, because the minute they start aging or notice something “wrong” with them they feel the need to do more PS so it’s like a slippery slope. Becoming at peace with your natural self is better than looking to PS to somehow “fix you”.

    Another bothersome thing about PS is that these doctors want your $$$$$$$$$. They don’t really care about your well being they just need you on that operating table so they can get their next paycheck. They’ve probably seen plenty of patients that looked absolutely fine as is but they didn’t hesitate to work on them. Either way, I can see how easy it would be for the PS industry to be corrupted so I wouldn’t want to get involved with it in the first place.

  149. anyone knew, there is this korean movies, I just saw the trailer, it was in the list of the most disturbing korean movie, and it was really gore and creepy, it told about a group of poor teen girls who pressured to be pretty, they end up scrape each other faces with scalpels.. gaaahhh*now you know why I haven’t seen the movie yet

  150. So, resume picture = photoshop? A little fix here and there to make it look better?

    Personally, I don’t really mind plastic surgery if it is for health and similar reasons (for example: removing a mole due to possible risks in the future, maybe a scar which you don’t want to look at, plastic surgery after a major accident, etc. ).

    I don’t even care if someoe does it, it’s their body. But people who chage alot of things and end up looking like dolls ( big eyes/huge eyes, etc. ) make me feel weird. In some cases, it’s kind of creepy…

    • When they showed that picture at ~7:19 of the two girls, I was a lil horrified. People say that Bom took it too far need to get their eyes checked, because she looks practically natural compared to those girls right there

      • Bom? Park Bom from 2ne1? No matter what others say, she looks decent to me.

        But those girls with huge eyes ? I have big eyes as a european but those eyes look like…I don’t know…out of a horror movie or something.
        I agree – huge eyes like that is taking it too far…Not to mention some girls who make their chin sharper and want to look like they jumped out of an anime.

        • Josh Chinnery

          They definitely look like they jumped right out of an anime. I don’t mind big eyes, but that is just no >_>

  151. I really think there is going to be a backlash. To many people will just start looking the same, and since so many people look like that, it will no longer be seen as attractive. Am I the only one who finds unique features attractive? Like I’m attractive to the things that make people look different. Certainly I wouldn’t want people to get plastic surgery so they would all look the same…
    Actually this entire idea is reminding me of an episode of the Twilight Zone. In this society once a person reaches a certain age they get a surgery done that changes everything about them. There are only a certain number of models, so in the end they all end up looking the same. It was quite eerie and scary, really. I would really recommend watching that episode! And that show was done decades ago and they were already thinking about it…

  152. lady_kire

    I think plastic surgery is alright if you don’t go all Heidi Montag or Michael Jackson.
    Like if you are there for health reasons or minor cosmetic reasons, then sure. (Minor as in one thing getting done)
    I still don’t understand the boob jobs though… It’s kinda obvious…

    My parents more or less teach me about being special in my own way, but at the same time, would shun me if I became fat.
    My dad believes every k-pop idol I listen to has had plastic surgery… Then again, he claims all my idols can’t sing and thinks one of the Pussycat dolls can… Also, I’m pretty certain every North American singer has had plastic surgery as well…

  153. About Minzy, she didn’t say she got plastic surgery because of her rhinitis. She said that she was already going to get surgery to fix the problem and after thinking about it for a long time decided to get plastic surgery on her nose too. She was explaining the process she went to, to get plastic surgery on her nose.

  154. Hey Simon and Martina, one thing you guys didn’t touch on in this video is this growing idea, not in Korea but in North America, that Korea’s obsession with plastic surgery is a result of their wanting to look “white” and I wanted to know what you think as white people living in Korea. Is this true or is it ridiculous? Thanks =)

  155. Can you talk about the Korean concept of beauty? I always thought that beauty was a universal concept, since it’s based on ratios and symmetry and whatnot. But it seems to me to be different in Korea? Like when groups do rankings based on looks, I always disagree! My Korean friends agreed that the Korean sense of beauty is different than in other countries, but they weren’t able to explain it to me. Maybe you guise might be able to explain? Thanks!

  156. Brielle Christina Beaver

    speaking of swamp donkeys: going off what simon mentioned in the last part of the video, did anyone here about this guy sueing his wife and winning? http://www.kineda.com/man-successfully-sues-wife-over-ugly-children-and-judge-orders-wife-to-pay-120000/

  157. Thanks for doing this video! I think it’s really important that people understand that plastic surgery isn’t always the best option and I think that you should also think about other people before you do it so that, for example, you can be a good example to your own kids or other people you know! Learning to love yourself is tough but I think it’s a worthy thing to do. Thank you guys! ♡

  158. I think if you’re already at the top of your field like Minzy, there is no need for an elective procedure or to lose a lot of weight. Seriously, you’ve got millions of people that <3 everything about you, don't change your brand. Coach, Chanel, Dior and other brands wouldn't change their logo or their signature style, I don't understand why someone would do so to their personal brand. I have applauded the anti-surgery (public) stance that YG has and since it's well known, I have to push the I believe button and think that medically it would be beneficial. Her face is her brand and it's how the company and she herself make their money, any change to it I assume is strictly considered. I think it was a risky move, as was her weight loss, but that's the Westerner in me speaking. Who knows, it might help her out in other markets.
    As a side piece of squirrelly wrath on the subject, shame on the people that push surgery/weight -loss especially if they mask their emotional abuse/control in "love" like her mom.

    • First of all,
      Minzy is the least popular of 2NE1, she along with CL are considered UGLY. Since when was YG EVER against Plastic surgery? Yes, he might be against it for the new YG girl group but that is an exception. YG suggested CL to get surgery, but she didn’t. As much as you deny it, I am positive Bom has gotten surgery.
      Does it really matter if she got surgery? It is not like it is interfering with her singing. On the contrary, she sounds better now. It doesn’t matter how many people love your look if you don’t love it yourself.
      She’s been receiving a lot of positive comments for her surgery, and honestly, it’s going to give her more popularity.
      She looked pretty before the surgery and after the surgery.
      Honestly, if it doesn’t interfere with her singing and dancing . WHO CARES.

      • I don’t really care in the long run, no need to come across so hostile. It’s her face and her brand, not mine. My disappointment won’t affect my purchasing or liking of her work nor will it affect my preference for Minzy. It is a comment on an industry that pushes unnecessary surgery/weight-loss.

        Regardless if she’s what you define as “least popular” she still has fans, she still works, she’s still loved as she is. The point I was making was that THAT should count for something in decision making process.

        I have read from more than one outlet on more than one occasion that there is a preference for no surgery. Don’t ask where as I can’t recall.

        I don’t quite understand your hostility since, if you check again, I said “I have to push the I believe button and think that medically it would be beneficial”. I realize that providing her with more oxygen for her body is a good thing, that is a no-brainer. Again, she’s always been my favorite and this won’t change it.

        • Michelle9Jaejoong4

          Nope not being hostile what’s so ever, Minzy is my favorite member of 2NE1. I’m even part of the staff for their largest international fansite.

          -I have no idea where you got the info about them preferring no surgery- i suppose if she is already “pretty” no need to spend money on her.

          The only issue that I had with all of this surgery thing was that her mom encouraged her to do it….

          [Exclusive] Gong Minzy, the secret to becoming prettier? “I got my nose done” direct admit
          Source: OSEN via Naver

          1. [+12,092, -368] Better than denying it.. It’s not like she isn’t talented anyway. I wish her more success.

          2. [+9,986, -236] She had to admit it because it was obvious to anyone that she got it done… but that’s really a daebak transformation with one nose job.

          3. [+6,683, -190] I like that she’s confidently admitting it

          4. [+4,491, -424] Minzy-ya, I love you!

          5. [+2,010, -28] Yang CEO, how about you focus on keeping Park Bom away from plastic sutgery

          -

          Source: Nate

          1. [+2,049, -47] Good

          2. [+1,993, -98] It’s fine. Why would she ever get hated on for that? She admitted it. What’s so wrong with getting her nose done by suggestion of her parents while getting surgery for rhinitis anyway? Just imagine how much of your hate about her face that her parents had to put up with to make them actually suggest it to her.

          3. [+90, -8] She looks way~~~ prettier ㅎ But don’t get any more work done…

          4. [+74, -12] I like it when celebrities directly admit it like this

        • Michelle9Jaejoong4

          Nope not being hostile whats so ever, Minzy so happens to be my favorite member of 2ne1. I’m even part of the staff for their largest international fansite.

          LMAO she IS the least popular when it comes to domestic fans, i mean I am talking about their home country. Their Korean fans. She is the one with the least fans.

          The only issue I have with all of this was that her mother encouraged her to do it, but that’s about it.

          Source: OSEN via Naver

          1. [+12,092, -368] Better than denying it.. It’s not like she isn’t talented anyway. I wish her more success.

          2. [+9,986, -236] She had to admit it because it was obvious to anyone that she got it done… but that’s really a daebak transformation with one nose job.

          3. [+6,683, -190] I like that she’s confidently admitting it

          4. [+4,491, -424] Minzy-ya, I love you!

          5. [+2,010, -28] Yang CEO, how about you focus on keeping Park Bom away from plastic sutgery

        • That is my main issue too! The pressure from her mom is the wtf part for me. I spent 10+ years with an eating disorder so I get a little concerned at un-needed weight loss.

          I do stand by my brand comment though that was also an international-based comment as well. My reasoning for that is Jennifer Grey from Dirty Dancing. Her nose job meant the end of her career effectively since it so dramatically changed her look. That having been said, for her home market, she did the right thing. And at the end of the day, two facts remain: her body, her damb business and I have never been opposed to cosmetic surgery.

          I totally didn’t mean to sound bitchy or anything earlier btw.

        • I totally posted from my phone earlier and it looks like it didn’t take! Sometimes Disqus makes me want to smack it.

          I realize that I might’ve sounded a lot bitchier than I’d intended. If so, man am I sorry. I was referencing an international market in my comments, I know that what she had done will only help her at home. I was using Jennifer Grey as a mental example, got her nose done post Dirty Dancing and was pretty much unrecognizable and could no longer work. Additionally, I spent 10+ years with an eating disorder so I get a little upset about extreme/not needed weigh-loss

          However, at the end of the day, I can have an opinion but it’s really not even worth anything and there are only two facts: first, her body, her choice period and second, I actually have no issues with cosmetic surgery, I think we should all be encouraged to do what we can to be our own idea of attractive. On that note, I also find her mother’s behavior/attitude reprehensible. That, my dear, is not love. That is abuse. If a man had said that to her, every single person here would, I assume, be rightfully indignant but since it’s her mom and mommies are sacred…it’s even worse.

  159. What impress me the most is that those people who actually make those surgeries aren’t afraid at all and they don’t care about the healling procedure. I am even afraid to go for stitches and needless to say that I don’t like be in pain when I have an accident. But those people choose to suffer and be in pain. How come they don it so easily. Enter a clinic have a surgery which is not life depending surgery and they choose to be in pain afterwards.

  160. Monolids do exist outside of East Asia, just not in abundance. Middle East, Russia, Scandinavia ( ex. Iceland, Norway, Sweden, Finland/Sami ), Native Americans, and some parts of Africa all have a small percentage of the population born with natural monolids. It’s not exclusive to Asia at all, it’s just much more abundant there. Here’s an article that talks about 4 different types of monolids – http://monolidlove.onsugar.com/Monolids-101-13388443

  161. Have you guys watched this Vice documentary: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0wWKjxxM6q8
    Charlet (the host) goes to a plastic surgery clinic and figured out the different perceptions of “beautiful” in different culture. It really opened my eyes when she says that the Chinese woman feel inferior when she was told that she shouldn’t have wanted to have a face like Charlet’s. It’s interesting to understand other’s perception of beauty!

  162. Graciela Ivonne

    The trouble with plastic surgery is when are you satisfied with yourself? I’m overweight and have a big nose. Am I the prettiest? No. But there just aren’t enough people who accept themselves the way they are. I feel like there’s always going to be something you want to change about yourselves just because everyone has that thing they’re insecure about. Hopefully society won’t continue to sell plastic surgery as the easy fix. I’m a big believer that if you’re beautiful on the inside it does make you more beautiful on the outside.

    Unfortunately, they are still so many people who need reforming surgery on their thoughts.

    • I agree, but at the same time I do want to change my nose. I’m not talented with makeup and dislike wearing too much of it, so using the makeup ‘tricks’ isn’t really something I care to do. It really takes a lot of time to do it as well. I like everything else except my nose ( and teeth, but that’s entirely different imo ). If I had the money, I’d get my nose done.
      There are people who feel like everything is wrong though, and some of them do need to change their attitude – but some of them need real help, like if they have Body Dysmorphic Disorder. That’s not just mere insecurity, but too often it’s only seen as that and not a real mental problem.

      • Graciela Ivonne

        I completely agree. I have a friend who suffers from Body Dysmorphia and I myself have suffered from depression and they are most certainly not things where you just “get over it”. And they are definitely mental conditions that remain as a struggle for the rest of your life, but the world is just too full of “quick fixes” and superficial solvers when many times the underlying problem is never dealt with. I’m not judging or condemning anyone who would do plastic surgery, but I’m just saying that people need to be more aware of their motives… if that makes sense.

  163. I have small eyes but double eyelids, as I’m not Asian. I read that making my eyes bigger through surgery was impossible. I bet they’d do it in Korea though. But I don’t care anymore. 얼짱 models don’t make me jealous anymore. I can look prettier painted in makeup and with false eyelashes too. Anyone can (except those PS monsters, they’d just look creepier). Gain is wonderful; she’s self conscious about her eyeliner but she embraces her eyes because she knows she’s hot. (^_^)b

    My mom sees me watching shows like music bank and says about the boy groups, “They all look the same.” I’m like, “Psh. You should see the girls.”
    I can only imagine those girls that get their entire face blueprint-done are either still really insecure or arrogant. Kwanghee is pretty funny because he’s both. Sometimes I can’t tell if he’s serious when he compares himself to other idols..

    • Graciela Ivonne

      well every sarcastic remark does have a seed of truth. we say a lot of things meaning to be humorous, but in honesty are the things that bother us internally so i wouldn’t be surprised if in the back of kwang hee’s mind he’s being serious. and as an art student i love using make up and seeing how strong the illusion make up allows us. i have small eyes too and eye liner is magical.

      isn’t always true that we find what we don’t have attractive? i really find ga in and monolid eyes so beautiful, but so many koreans conform themselves to a western look whether it’s their eyes or nose bridge.

  164. Is anyone else wondering when Martina learned that Simon could stick his thumb up his nose?

  165. I have a mole on my face but it’s flat. People call it a beauty mark but it looks irregular in shape maybe because I scratched of the skin when i was younger. Since I am not sure, do you think it will get cancerous and should I get it removed? I know you might not be the most certified people to answer me, but I want your opinions ^^. I don’t know if I should get it removed because it’s a characteristic for my features, but if it’s threatening, then it has to be done. Advice?

    • You should see a doctor if you suspect that a mole could be more than just a mole. Definitely one with irregular edges should be at least looked at. Any new moles or ones with irregular shapes or changing in any way should be checked out.

      • Thank you for replying. I had this mole on my cheek since my childhood. since I scratched the skin off before, I felt maybe that’s why it has irregular edges. I don’t remember if it was irregular before that. I’ll get it checked out at a Korean clinic hopefully.

        Simon and Martina, which clinic did you use to get yours removed?^^

  166. AH! You guys mentioned the relativistic Sapir-Whorf hypothesis! That makes me so happy for some reason!

  167. I think if I ever stayed in South Korea for a while, I would have the mole surgery done. It’s a lot more expensive here :X There are two that I want removed, one is big and ugly on my ear and the other is moderately sized and ugly on my face. They are both bigger than they probably should be so I probably need to have them done anyway but I haaaaate them. I am fine with people getting plastic surgery if they want to. I know for me I am self conscious because of the 2 moles I mentioned. I really hate them and would be a lot happier if they were gone.

    For the picture of all the beauty contestants, I understand what you mean about the similar face. They don’t all look the same to me, you can see different features in all of them, but they are similar. However, if you look at the pictures of them without all that makeup and professional lighting, you would find that they look even more different from each other. So keep in mind sometimes it is makeup magic rather than plastic surgery that makes people look similar.

  168. i cant judge people who had undergone PS with out knowing their whole story.. some of them get bullied and lost their self esteem etc.. esp when you live in country where PS is a normal thing to do or they get as a gift after graduating high school..

    • Well if they’re getting bullied then something needs to be done about bullying in SK, or if they lost their self esteem then they should get therapy– which goes along with the mental health issue in SK. But those are huge social problems so I guess resolving them would be really difficult :/

  169. I’m not against plastic surgery, but I am totally against forced surgery, whether by family, friends, business and society. More seems so far-fetched that the initiative of the person who will undergo surgery.

    Also I think the excuse of Minzy is BS, just wish it had her party, her initiative, her will and not under pressure from anyone else.
    Korea worries excessively about the appearance to the point of thinking that doing PS meant “good winds, fortune, happiness”. If wealthy celebrities, full of money and fame has no full happiness, why people believe that surgery will make her “happily ever after”? The “happily ever after” is only in fairy tales. We have moments of happiness (unfortunately it is so)

    I get frustrated with these things. Our short life is based only by physically appearances and how we appear and want others to believe how we are.
    The worst thing is to see that this has no end.

  170. I love minzy to bits, I still do but I must admit I was saddened by that decision. Yes, it’s her choice, but what really bothered me was the fact that her mother put it out there. What also bothered me, was that her own mother was upset that she wasn’t as skinny as the other girls even though she was at the gym a lot. She wasn’t skinny, but she did have muscle, that comes from working out and eating right, why did it matter that she wasn’t skinny. IDK, whatever, again, her choice.

  171. It looks worse than it actually is in photos because girls wear the same makeup style and photoshop their faces similarly and end up looking like clones.

    for example

    https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcS5uqPDOTeXTD3cvcN9EAqJyicMYxbhGU3UnB5ArIFKpV3LjtZ9Gw

  172. i dont think i can ever get plastic surgery…way too scary..

  173. Well, according to the latest statistics, there are 796 plastic surgery clinics in Korea, 402 in Seoul, 288 in Gangnam.
    http://gss.gangnam.go.kr/jsp/GSS1/vd.jsp (보건->진료과별 의원수)
    Yeah, I admit that PS is overwhelmingly popular and lookism is rampant in Korea. I’m ashamed and upset as a Korean, but where on earth did 500 PS clinics come from? I know it’s not that different and you always make an effort to be fair and cautious about serious topics like this. Figures are not so important, I just have some suspicion lately that you guys sometimes mention something randomly. I hope not.

    • Hi – just wanted to chime-in regarding those stats from the Gangnam govt site in your comment. Those are clinics who have officially gone through the registration process with government (taxes, licensing, zoning, etc…). Plastic Surgery is not as regulated in Korea as say the USA. There are a very large number of unregistered clinics offering plastic surgery that have not classified themselves as “plastic surgery” with their local ward. For instance, many orthodontic clinics offer maxillofacial surgery for cosmetic purposes such as genioplasty (chin bone cutting and moving) and two-jaw surgery, but may be classified as “dental clinic.” Also, a large number of skin clinics offering cosmetic surgery procedures such as body contouring, hair transplants, fat injections, derma fillers and laser skin resurfacing are not classified as a plastic surgery clinics. There are several strategic tax and red tape avoidance benefits depending on how you classify your practice in Korea. “Gangnam” colloquially means ‘South of the River.’ At Gangnam Station, if you simply walk out of exits #10, 9, 8, 7, 6 and 5 you are not in Gangnam govt’s jurisdiction anymore, but in Seocho’s. However, most locals and natives will still say you are in Gangnam. There are large number of clinics around Gangnam Station, which are technically in Seocho. If you watch the MBC news clip above (00:35 sec), referring to clinics in Gangnam, you can hear the reporter mention “500 surgery clinics.” Simon and Martina essentially made the same mention as MBC – a major Korean news broadcasting network.

      • Oh my bad!! I didn’t think that detailedly. I was initially doubtful about that figure, so searched stats straight without reading this blog and watching the news clip. I’m deeply sorry to doubt it, Simon and Martina.

  174. that’s what I post in my tumblr about my opinion of minzy’s ps!! but I got scolded from butthurt fans!! sigh.. I said that I just a bit dissappointed about her decision. But that’s not mean I hate her! You are right when you said Minzy WAS a role model for young girl to embrace their own appeareance. I mean I thought Minzy was really cute and pretty and adorable even before and she is like the most well-rounded member in her group imo.. In my case, i also have kinda flat and round nose and also kinda big nostril lol , I’ve move on from every kids that said things to me when I was young. My mom said that there’s nothing wrong with my nose and even my kind of nose’s shape known to breathe better and is far from the risk of sinus disease.. but still, I’m not that confident about it, moreover if some boys insult it.. But everytime I saw female artist with similar image I kinda feel better, and Minzy was like the perfect role model for me. I can even make jokes with my own nose lol!! But well her decision is rather dissappointed but yeah she’s still Minzy. And the pressure for being pretty must be no joke there.. it’s kinda sad and ridiculous, well..

    then again YG can’t do bs about “Our artist is natureal bla bla bla”… well they have bom before and it’s kinda obvious.. but still lol!! papa YG y’think y can fool us tsk tsk tsk bad YG

  175. Talking about the surgery for rhinitis, actually my dad got that once and it do really help. he had a constant runny nose(sometimes more sometimes less) but then he did some kind of surgery(don’t really know if it changed his appearance at all since i was to young xD) But it helped! But don’t know if it changes the noseshape in anyway..

  176. I’m a Korean, I have monolids. Some people including my own aunt advised me to get double-lids surgery done, then Sohee, Gain and Yuna Kim became popular, Boom! Monolids became “unique” feature and now some people think it as “chic” but no, sadly it’s still not the “mainstream” beauty. Jerks.

    Fellow Nasties, I’m curious. Are there “the ultimate look” most women pursue in other countries as well? What kinds of plastic surgeries are popular in your country?

    • I guess the most common plastic surgery in my country is boob job, and maybe after is liposuction… I mean, everyone wants to be skinny and still have great boobs

    • its not very common in our country..but getting white flawless skin is..

    • Well I’m mexican American having lived 21 years in the US and the past 5 in Mexico :
      In the US – BOOBS! Liposuction! Nose! Face-lifts for the older peeps :)

      In mexico: Boobs! butts! Lips! Thighs! nose! Cheek bone shaving + fat removal so as to not have prominent cheekbones that make you look “chubby”

    • Really, before coming to Korea I only knew about boob jobs, nose jobs, and liposuction. Boob jobs are usually the most common. Otherwise, I only knew about anti-aging stuff, like botox or facelifts. It wasn’t until I came to Korea that I heard about double eyelid surgery, or jaw shaving surgery, or eye widening.

    • Crystal Chu

      i also heard that the dimple surgery is getting popular…. o.o its quite absurd actually…. well… I was born with dimples but seriously. people would actually pay shit to put two holes/slits in their cheeks?!!

    • In my country, plastic surgery isn’t that comment. I couldn’t tell you anyone (and I know a lot of people) that had plastic surgery, aside from breaking their noses playing sports and needing rhinoplasty.
      But here, it’s rhinoplasty (mainly because many seem to break their nose). I don’t hear much about it.
      I’m guessing lipo and boob jobs would be next, but then again, I haven’t heard anything about it.

  177. this is a cartoon of the exact same situation you discussed about :P

  178. Martina: Are you saying Aegyozilla is a gwaemul?
    Simon: *Okay brain, time to think carefully, do NOT say what you think! ABORT ABORT!*
    Simon: YES

    Simon: *Damn it brain*
    I love you guise xD

    I remember that phenomenon of I think it was Miss Korea contenders (?) who all had very similar facial features. I wasn’t sure if it was because of plastic surgery uniformity or because Miss Korea pageants look for particular facial features…
    Very interesting TL:DR as always :)

  179. In Poland plastic surgery isn’t popular, but a lot of companies want your picture in resume ;/ I don’t know why XD

  180. Akira Miyashi

    Just wanted to comment about your paragraph on Minzy. If I’m not mistaken, I thought that I read on Soompi that Minzy got her rhinitis cured by undergoing surgery but since she’s doing a surgery on her nose, her mom told her to also get a nose job. So it’s like a “I went to the grocer to get some veges, might as well get some fruits along the way too” kind of thing. I don’t think that she said her nose job was the cure to her rhinitis. Just wanted to clarify that that’s what I understood from what she said.

    “My mother suggested that since I was already getting corrective surgery to straighten my nose, I should also get plastic surgery.”

    Also, I really thought that Minzy was pretty and beautiful before her surgery as well as I am a bit disappointed with her company’s statement (which btw, is completely ridiculous). So yea….Just my thoughts on this.

  181. I read that Minzy’s mother told her she might as well get the ps on her nose done while she was at it and so Minzy thought about it and ending up agreeing to it. That made me so mad what kind of mother tells her daughter to get ps!? But Minzy must have talked to her mother about her dislikes for her nose otherwise that’s kinda messed up.

  182. When you theorized two “beautiful” koreans getting together and making a love child that looks like a swamp donkey, it reminded me of the book series I read in high school: Uglies. It’s almost like the future of South Korea where everyone goes through a surgery when they turn 16 to become one of the “pretties”. It is a bit alarming to say the least. Being from the states, plastic surgery has a major stigma attached to it which you two noted in the video. The idea of changing yourself to fit into a stereotypical hegemonic box of beauty ideals. Personally, I feel reconstruction surgery should be for those who actually need because of facial deformities rather than for personal beauty. Of course, I would never ostracize any one who received plastic/reconstruction surgery for personal/self-esteem means.

  183. Photos on your resume! Studios temper (or “make your photo look better”) the resume photos too much now everyone including people from HR department knows you can’t believe any resume photo, ha!
    But I must say, it’s not like you don’t get the job if your looks ain’t “perfect” (as some people might say). You get the job if you’re fit for it or have whatever abilities you need for the job, only there are some firms and particular job posts where they put much importance on looks of employees, like certain hotels or airline companies.

  184. I am bummed Minzy changed her nose and the fact that her Mom was the one who told her she should do it.
    I don’t think there is anything inherently wrong with plastic surgery, but I do find it sad how common it is in Korea and the extreme types that people opt for (Jaw shaving freaks me out.) Asians can be born with natural double eyelids, it’s just not as common. Also, I have met quite a few Koreans that dislike plastic surgery as well.

  185. Well, one good thing that you guys mentioned is that a lot of men are seeing the connotations of many women starting to look alike as a result of the plastic surgery craze. Maybe, as this craze continues to grow, a new trend with start – “The natural look”. Coming from the NorthEast U.S, I’ve never felt the need to have plastic surgery. I think that maybe as South Korea opens up to even more foreigners, the standard of beauty will change, and many young women AND men will see that beauty comes in all shapes and forms. Just because you dont look like the covergirl on a magazine, doesn’t mean you need to hack your body to pieces.

    However, I’m not totally against plastic surgery! I’ve seen many people who were so uncomfortable with a certain feature or body part, and once they had surgery on it, they felt so much better, and more confident about themselves. Plastic surgery can be great, but like all things, too much of anything can be a bad thing.

  186. I loved this TLDR, something I have wanted to see your guys opinion on very badly! One this I personally can verify from the blog post about Minzy is that no, Rhinoplasty does not help with Rhinitis. I had Sinus issues for years and wanted to get it fixed and hoped that an overall change in my nose would help, which would include getting the “bonus” enhancement of the outer appearance of my nose. But changing the outside appearance would do nothing for my health and all the work that needed to be done, would be done on the inside. I had the surgery and my nose looks the exact same as it has my whole life. ONLY it is very very slightly straighter and less swollen from always being infected.

    So overall… Minzy lies! :P

  187. Super kudos to you guys for really covering more on this topic even though I know some people will feel uncomfortable or judged from the topic simply being talked about. I’m pretty against plastic surgery and everything it means/represents, but I’m also very much on the stance of people’s bodies belong to them, they can do what they want.

    However, when you guys talked about ideal types of kgirls and kguys in korean culture, I found it really confusing that guys only expect the girls to be pretty, because they’ll basically be stay at home wives and give them a family (kids). However, by what I’ve researched and the forums my korean roommate let me go on her Naver account, the “pretty girls” that go after sky university guys are pretty competitive and (usually) had quite a bit of surgery done. So. If the guys really care so much about their future (kids) and they are mostly surrounded in the dating pool by girls who (most likely) had plastic surgery, then doesn’t that cancel each other out? You are going to have pretty wife, and mom to your kids, but then you’ll have to explain to your kids why they don’t have the same “good” genes?

    Obviously, this is not the case for EVERYONE. Sky university guys can go for less ideally pretty girls, or naturally “pretty” girls, but it just seems (to me) like this would be a reoccurring problem? I’d love to hear anyone’s thoughts on this. Obviously I don’t expect it to be every case, but in my head it seems like it’d be a common loophole/problem with the “ideal pretty” mentality korea encourages.

  188. To help out a bit with the term “plastic surgery”… In this case the term plastic originates not from the material we now know as such, but from the Greek phrase “πλαστική τέχνη” (plastiki tehni) which stands for “the art of sculpting (reshaping)”. Other than that as always great work guys. ^_^

  189. And then there are idols like Kim Heechul who asked the dr. to get rid of his double eyelids but the dr. wouldn’t do it XD though I do also remember him saying something about having his nose done because of some breathing condition…if that was the real case, who knows. There’s also Shindong who openly admits to having his eyes done, again because of a condition that had been causing the eyelids to droop or something like that and if I recall, someone from Shinhwa had the same thing done. On the note of idols, one thing that wasn’t mentioned that isn’t exactly plastic surgery but seems to be a trend with them is lasik, though it makes since with their schedule that they wouldn’t want to deal with contacts and other eye things.

  190. Minzy originally was only going to get the rhinitis surgery, which is only an internal surgery and doesn’t affect the outer appearance of your nose. But she said that her mom recommended that while she since she was already getting a surgery, she should fix her nose too, so I guess that’s what she did ._.
    She looked pretty before, but I mean she still looks pretty now. I think it’s also that a lot of Korean parents might say to their daughter (or son) to get plastic surgery, my friend in Korea told me that plastic surgery is sometimes even their graduation gift.

  191. It makes me sad that because plastic surgery is accepted too much in South Korea, there is only one standard. Like different looks are not good enough anymore. I used to be very conscious about my nose but then when a friend of mine said that it is so adorable, I started to feel a bit better about myself.

  192. I bet that in ten years or so every woman in S. Korea will have Kim Taehee’s face. Which will be super creepy.
    The thing is that the more people get PS to look a certain way the harder it will be to stay “natural”. I don’t condemn the people who get PS but I think the trend is really unhealthy for society.

  193. I can’t imagine even approaching a plastic surgery office. Maybe it’s just me, but i know I’m ugly, so why not take it in stride. If you really want it go for it. I would just stay me in the end though.

    There was kid of darker color in the states who auditioned for SM and he passed round 1 and 2 apparently but said no to signing a contract in the end due to the fact that SM wanted him to get plastic surgery.

  194. Natalia L

    I don’t know in other countries, but here in Spain and I’m almost sure in Argentina too, a photo is needed in your resume, I don’t know, it’s common practice. I actually didn’t know in America wasn’t.

    • I heard some people describe that a photo is often needed in Asian resumes since so many people have the “same name” or it is common to have several people with the same name.

    • In Switzerland it’s also normal to put a portrait photo on your resume. But it’s not really a big deal so I personally never felt the pressure to look beautiful because of it. You just try to look presentable, then you go to a photo booth or take it at home in front of a white wall (preferably in your pyjama pants, but with a nice shirt on xD)

  195. Funny you mention plastic surgery as a “gift,” because I’ve seen it in my neighborhood but much more uncommon. My friend was turning 18 and he Mom said she would pay for a boob job if she still wasn’t happy with herself by 18. She never got it done in the end.

    Plastic Surgery is really popular in South Jersey, but I find it crazy the differences. I see lots of ads for surgeons in magazines, and there is even a magazine for Plastic Surgery. But like you mentioned Asian surgeries seem to be more about modifying your face, while in the US it is more about boobs, butts, and abs. It is very much about perfecting the body and making wrinkles go away.

  196. AJ Jung

    Simon remember when you said like ‘what would happen if a hot korean guy and a hot korean girl had a love baby and had a swamp donkey?’ (…or something along those lines?)

    IT HAPPENED LIKE LEGITLY WAAAHTTT XD

    http://www.chicagonow.com/dad-all-day/2013/11/man-sues-wife-over-ugly-kids-and-wins/

    so pretty much this guy marries this korean girl and they have babies that don’t seem like they are from the family since they look completely not like them and so he sues her
    turns out she got a looooaaddd of plastic surgery and so in order to balance it out she has to pay him the cost of all of her surgeries….

    …WHAT HAS THE WORLD COME TO DDDD:

  197. Aw man, was hoping that the “I’m a certified doctor” comment was going to lead to a Memmers vid so that we could all realize that he’s been writing the blog posts all along. XD

  198. hey guise, good days, idk why but i couldn’t play the video. any suggestion??

  199. So basically there’s people trying to look good so they can get a job… and there’s Simon who’s too handsome for the job! Like a boss! XD

    I think in Spain it’s almost compulsory to attach a picture to you CV. I mean, you don’t have to do it if you don’t want to but probably must employers will ignore your CV altogether. It’s really unfair.

  200. Some fun facts about Korea from the International Society of Aesthetic Plastic Surgery’s 2011 survey http://www.isaps.org/Media/Default/global-statistics/ISAPS-Results-Procedures-2011.pdf

    #7 in registered plastic surgeons (1250)
    #7 in total procedures (649,938)
    #5 in Rhinoplasty (31,863)
    #5 in Laser Hair Removal (52,825)

  201. Some fun facts about Korea from the International Society of Aesthetic Plastic Surgery’s 2011 survey (http://www.isaps.org/Media/Default/global-statistics/ISAPS-Results-Procedures-2011.pdf)

    #7 in registered plastic surgeons (1250)
    #7 in total procedures (649,938)

    #5 in Rhinoplasty (31,863)

    #5 in Laser Hair Removal (52,825)

  202. Isabel Ruby

    can you make a open the happy video or even just a vine of simon putting his thumb up his nose just so we has video evidence?

  203. Ash3070

    So if there are so many surgeons available is it cheaper than in other places in the world? I know for instance, you mentioned mole removals but for more complicated procedures such as nose jobs, how does it compare to getting work done in other countries? x x x

  204. Im just saying, Minzy didn’t say she didn’t get cosmetical surgery, she said she had to get some kind of surgery on her nose to fix something, and her mother reccomended that she should get cosmetical surgery too while she’s at it. She full on admitted to getting cosmetic surgery. (back when i read that, I was a little horrified how your own mother would say to you to get surgery, but it seems like it’s a normal thing, seeing as the PS is given as a gift for students…)

  205. I totally know what Simon meant when he said now that he is married he doesn’t care about getting plastic surgery. One of my favourite expressions is “Monogamy means only having to impress one person”

  206. I agree that more and more people (women especially) are starting to have that same sort of look that makes their appearances look almost the same…it’s quite unatural and I’m a bit disturbed but the unaturally large eyes that some women have..

  207. I read somewhere that a chinese man sued his wife for lying about having plastic surgery and won. The funny thing is he discovered it when their baby was born and didn’t look like his mother at all

  208. xuan6793

    I was born chinese, and raised in Peru, having points of views on both countries’ mentality. Actually, I came to Peru when I was 3, and went back after almost fourteen years, I have grown literally listening to my mom go on to having double eyelid sugery,once I had the opportunity to go back to China. My cousin, my sister and I actually have monolid eyes, and when my sister and I came back to China, it was almost as if the point of traveling there was for the surgery, not see opur family whatsoever. Actually I see no difference in her eyes, or her work field, and me personally, I love my monolids and I feel that it is what makes me different in a way.
    In Peru, on the other hand,people go for breast and butt surgery, being curvy the “it” body type, and I’ve seen on the news, people dying from injecting “airplane oil” into their butts, having has surgeries in illegal clinics.
    What I am trying to convey are two points:one is in asian countries, PS is so common, that are some that are performed in hospital, with certified doctors and so on, that it is worrying. My other point I’m drawing is, plastic surgery is already a world thong, varying only on different parts of the body depending of which country, and like so, illegal clinics are everywhere, so it is recommendable to proceed wit lots of caution and thoughts into it, because it is an invasive procedure. U.U

  209. Hmm this is a difficult disussion…but I feel like sometimes you understand where the person getting surgery is coming from (let’s say they were badly bullied) and even if you find them beautiful, you kinda want them to ease the pain. But another part of me is outraged that it has become a standard to physically buy beauty to meet aesthetic standards in a professional setting. Is it because people are “over-qualified” and they’re trying to limit people with other means? Something is wrong and I’m not just talking about Korea. And what’s weird to me is that coming from a country where Neo-Confucian values are still going strong and that you should respect your elders, how is changing what your parents give you socially acceptable? And why has it come to the point where parents are happy to offer surgeries as gifts? The pressure must be ridiculous to get people to freak out and transform themselves radically (or not) just to get some sort of professional or social recognition. I’m confused.

  210. Susie

    Like you guys, I have mixed feelings and thoughts on plastic surgery. As an 18-year-old girl that was born in Korea but lived in Australia since the age of 1, I feel that I have a look at the topic from an “foreigner’s perspective”, but with a bit more understanding(?). I always get offered “little fixes” by my aunties when I come to Korea from Australia. There’s always a “you wanna/should split your eyes(?)” or “Wow, your jaw’s a little defined (meaning you’d look better if you shaved it” with the most being “wanna lift your nose a little? Just a little”. It took me a while to understand that they weren’t doing it to be bitchy and shallow but I will admit that it gets under my skin if I think about it in a bad mood by myself before I go to sleep. Not only is it “feature fixing” things but I occasionally get the whole, “Hey, this acupuncture thing makes you lose your appetite and lose weight, you should try it” or the “I swear if you lived and exercised with us in Korea, you’d lose so much weight” which I never get back home as a 5’3″ girl of 120-ish pounds.

    While I understand that people have the right to do what they want with their bodies and what makes them feel better about themselves, watching Korean shows like “Let Me In (미인)” makes me infuriated that people are living and struggling in a society that tells them that they’re not good enough because of how they were born. I’ll quickly shut up by saying that while the entire nation’s not like this and intentions aren’t always bad and shallow, that I sometimes feel like the entire nation’s got this obsession or this “sickness” when I come here and it can really stress people out. Really glad you guys talked about this.

    Thank you! <3

    • xuan6793

      I lived a similar experience, but it was my mom that keep going on ” you should have double eyelid” or you should have done it, when you went to China”. The intention is not bad but it boggles my mind every single time, as if my eyes were bad or something.

    • i hate that show ‘Let Mi-In’ too. Seriously, if they are going to help the candidates (the idea of choosing a candidate itself is ridiculous), just fix the problems they have. if she has terribly twisted teeth, or abnormal bone structure,
      just fix that and leave out the eyes and the jawline.

      • Susie

        I think over anything else, the show’s a scary reminder that the world can be a cruel place. I honestly can’t understand and don’t want to understand why a group of teenage girls could think they have the right to tell someone to go kill themself or make them swallow dishwasher soap. Absolutely horrifying and utterly depressing.

        • Jackie Outlaaw

          yes, that’s true. i remember one episode of a woman with a really flat chest who didn’t even fill up an AA cup, and she said her husband would cheat on her over bustier girls, and she got really self-conscious.
          LET-MI-IN staff members are crazy though, because they came up with an event where the husband re-proposed to her after her breast enhancement. that kind of feed in to women’s minds that men will love you if you have a larger bust, but will not if you are cutting-board flat. i understand that the show made him do so to make the woman feel better, but it would make much more sense if they blamed him for being an asshole and transform him into a romantic husband all of a sudden.
          at least make him apologize to her sincerely…

      • They have a similar American show (can’t remember the name) where they pick people who apparently dress poorly and end up fixing things like their teeth as well and they showcase them in a see through case that people walk by on the street and who comment about their poor appearance and then they put them in front of a panel of judges who discuss why after they completely overhauled the way they look they are better off.

    • Family does that in many cultures. Tell their kids to lose weight because they are fat, get double eyelids, get breast augmentation or reduction.

      My mother and aunts constantly nag me about being thin, greeting me by calling me bony or by asking if I wore kids sizes. It really hurt my feelings and I wanted to tell them, “You should lose some pounds yourself.” I don’t give a shit anymore though. I just ignore it. Like, if you want me to “eat a sandwich,” I heard about this great restaurant, *nudge nudge* (I’m the only one besides my dad to clear their own plate when we eat out, but of course they wouldn’t notice). They always made my sister feel self conscious about her big boobs to the point where she was wearing 2-3 bras at one time.

      I honestly can’t tell if it’s concern or them shifting their own insecurities onto their relatives.

      • My friend gets these “You should eat a hamburger” comments all the time, even though she eats more than most of us (no ogfense friend)

        • Tara Doherty

          When I was in my last year of middle school I became very paranoid, my ex would always say mean things about me(throughout the year I came to conclude that he still liked me but said bad things about me so that others wouldn’t think he still had feelings for me).

          Nevertheless, he repeatedly called me anorexic. I weighed about 95 pounds that year and my stomach which noone really ever sees cause it’s school was this ( http://tinypic.com/view.php?pic=2zxovfm&s=6#.Uq6UovRDuSo ). When I told my friends(I had a lot of online friends) about being called anorexic in school, they would ask well are you?. Well I would send them this picture and ask do I look too skinny?. Noone said that I looked anorexic. And I wasn’t.

          I accounted about 40 “You should eat more”s, maybe 5 “You should eat a hamburger”s, and a few “put some meat on those bones”.

          I have ADHD, I have been taking medication for it since I was 7. One thing that the medicine does is lessen my appetite. I eat big breakfasts and big dinners. However in school I wouldn’t eat allot for lunch in my elementary days. In middle school a common lunch meal for me was a m&m ice cream cookie http://media-cdn.tripadvisor.com/media/photo-s/03/8b/9f/17/m-m-s-world.jpg . It was cheap and convenient and it was enough to get me through the day. I also had a larger portioned ice cream cup that I bought from the school lunch line more frequently. But towards the end of the year I started having a friends fruit from the lunch line. I don’t like school food.

          Anyways being that I didn’t eat much food in Middle School, lots of kids thought I never ate. Well it’s Middle School. I remember my resource room teacher was talking about having a pizza party at the end of the year and I was soo excited for it. My ex was in that class also and he said something like “She could use a piece or two of it” or “she could gain a pound”. And for some reason his friends thought it was really funny. At home I eat 4 slices of pizza sometimes.

          This year I’m really good friends with the exchange student from Thai (I am in 10th grade now). She knows I am not anorexic, but I find it very funny when she worries about me dieting. I eat a apple everyday now for lunch, I am thinking of eating more for lunch now too because well I get really hungry now. She says that if I go on a diet I will look like a twig and I laught. I tell her “You had too see what I ate when I was in Middle School.”. I don’t plan on going on a diet diet, a diet to me is just eating healthier food.

    • thenonprocrastinator .

      Just seeing the phrase “split your eyes” gives me the shivers. Ugh…D:

  211. I’m really glad to see you guys talking about this topic! It feels like a lot of people in Korea who have criticism towards plastic surgery are kind of…afraid? not the perfect word..to talk about it.

    I remember my very first month in Korea, when I would constantly stare at young people, thinking ‘damn, they sure are good looking’, but then I started noticing that so many actually look alike, not in a racist ‘all Asians look the same’ kind of way, but actually alike, like siblings – same shape of the eyes, nose, even face. And there was a huge difference between the so called ‘beautiful people’ and the ordinary – skin tone, general facial features…it actually freaked me out!

    I talked to a girl friend of mine, and asked about this stuff, she told me the same that you guys talked about – plastic surgery is considered a commodity nowadays, easily accessible and almost required! If you’re good looking according to the ‘standard’, life will be easier, better. And then I look back at the idols, and how most Korean people I met admit to feeling pressure to look a certain way because of them, and I just feel like slapping myself back to reality from this nightmare. Because in my eyes, Korean people are very ‘good looking’ naturally. Sounds uber shallow, I’m aware of that, but whenever I look at my friends they really have beautiful features.

    I’m not against plastic surgery, everyone has the right to their own bodies, I just think that the general notion that’s very prominent here in Korea that ‘there is a certain way you should look like, or else….’ is bonkers, and really messes with people’s minds. Even my psychology professor talked about this, and what a huge social problem it has become, as it basically says that looks are far more important than your personality, education and personal values.

  212. I’ve been dealing with low self esteem since I started school. I actually tried out for a record company, since I am a songwriter the guys words were “Your voice is great, but get your teeth and face fixed, lose some weight then we’ll sign you…” I asked him to elaborate. I was 16 at the time, sure I was teased, but my mom always taught me to go after my dreams. “Oh, a couple of cheek and chin implants, braces and losing about 30 lbs will work wonders for you…come back in a year we’ll definitely sign you…” I never cried so hard in my life up to that point. I would’ve caved into the pressure too, but I didn’t have a job at the time to pay for the surgery. My sister was pissed when I told her what was said.

    To this day, it still haunts me, that was ten years go. I’m not as skinny as I was back then. I still write music, but I no longer want to be famous for it. That killed the passion for me. I figure if people can’t take me for who I am and what I look like, then they aren’t worth having in my life. Why change my body for a bit of fame? I’m happy with who I am and that’s all that should matter. I wish everyone else thought the same.

    • I like your words!! hope you being positive always and all of us as well!! :D

    • I’m so sorry to hear that. Really.

      Part of me also is like “fuck making music for anyone else” at the same time, so you don’t have to deal with this. I’m sorry if I’m a bit too hipsterish, but the two of us are wholly in the spirit of being independent artists (though what we do isn’t really art). Make music because you want to make music. Do stuff on YouTube. Do stuff on SoundCloud. Do your own shows. Don’t work for asshole companies that tell you your talent is unusable because of how you look. Why would anyone want to work for people like that? Ugh! Especially in this day and age, where people more than ever before can make a living being independent artists, don’t work for big companies, man. Don’t do it.

  213. Doctor Swapping is the instance in which you would pay for surgery from, say, a great doctor with a fantastic reputation, but as soon as you’re unconscious they put in a different, lesser qualified doctor. I WAS LIKE WTF … is that for real O.O damn people wtf is wrong with u …

  214. Actually we put a pic into our resumee as well in Germany. :o Didn’t know it is such a big deal for you. o,o

    • I’ve had to provide a picture only once for a job application and I had to get a passport photograph done. It has nothing to do with retouching or making yourself look good to get considered, I think it’s just for identification purposes.
      However, I do feel like it’s a little unnecessary because a picture doesn’t say much about you. I think that’s where people are coming from when saying that it’s unfair or ridiculous to attach a picture, especially if you take the time and energy to get it retouched. It sends the message that people are more concerned about how you look than what you’ve accomplished.

      • It’s just to see if the person has like 4968943 tattoos / piercings in their face, washes their hair and idk.. if you work with customers.. or at a luxury restaurant idk… yeah.. I think this pic is very much needed.

  215. I lived in Seoul for three years and I didn’t have plastic surgery, but I did have Lasik surgery to correct my severe nearsightedness. If anyone sees this I can only say that I hope you have a good close Korean friend you can trust. In my experience Korean people always showed themselves to be kind and genuinely concerned. I had various friends go with me to each appointment and confirm that the surgery would be done by the chief of ophthalmology. If you can’t get someone you truly trust to go with you I would say it is not worth it. Surgery is simple when everything goes as it should, but that doesn’t mean it should be taken lightly. You only have one body for the rest of your life.

  216. PunkyPrincess92

    WHOA!!!!! over 500???? in Gangnam alone….
    and how the hell do you choose which one to go to?

    i have never noticed eyelids ever…until i got into kpop haha~ and i had to google it!!!

    *acts like i’m in pain* oh my god….the jaw shaving….sounds gross and painful..and uncomfortable!!! even reading it makes me get the heebie jeebies!!! (ahahah haven’t used that one in a long time!!!)

    whoa!!!! those pictures of girls with the ps!!! sorry but they look creeeeeeeeepy!!

    i was sad about Minzy’s ps too!! i waaaayyy prefer her old nose!! i never even thought anything looked wrong with it!!

    O_O doctor swapping? that is terrible!!

    anyway this talk reminds me of a quote by Key
    “I think girls with style are more beautiful than ones with a pretty face, small face, skinny, double eyelids. If guys keep going after that plain look, every girl’s face might look the same. It’d be a scary day.”

  217. I agree with you and other commenters. I thought Minzy was beautiful before, and it’s such a shame to me that she didn’t think so, or that she let others make her feel that way.

    It took me many years (and getting past a lot of teasing as a kid) to accept and like my nose as a part of accepting my overall self, and it seems like the quick fix of plastic surgery denies people the chance for long-term self-acceptance. On the other hand, people can do whatever they want with their bodies, I guess, as long as it makes them happy.

  218. hey everyone!! I am half greek and i did some research and I saw that greece is the in second place in plastic surgeries. I don’t know if it is true but if they do most people (females) do it in breast,ass,nose like everyone and especially celebrities all over the world ..the difference is that the society is not that obsessed with plastic surgery like in korea (well that’s what I see) they don’t try to change completely themselves..

  219. People are free to do whatever they want to themselves, as long as they know all of their options. I think there are simpler ways to stand out or fit in, such as a new haircut, makeup, or clothes. Sometimes people who resort to permanent modifications such as plastic surgery (or tattoos), don’t fully understand the outcomes. Plastic surgery won’t automatically solve all of their social issues. Also, any type of invasive procedure will come with risks, complications, not only during the surgery, but also with the healing process. I personally wont consider plastic surgery, but I do admit to using more conservative measures, such as makeup and clothes, to either fit in or stand out, depending on the situation.

  220. hey Martina, i get that you were really upset over that guy, but don’t be.
    i have a feeling that he said that to attract a customer, not because your nose looked weird (it’s cute).
    remember, salesmen use the technique of fear to get people to buy things.

  221. Marzia Matalone

    Well, this was really interesting since I’ve been thinking about it for a while…I have nothing against small plastic surgery, untill it is something like getting your nose done a little better or something like that,..I mean, if it is something that people feel it’s necessary for themselves, since it causes a complex or a low self-esteem, then, why not? But, really, getting your face like redone all over again since you have to look like a barbie doll… NO! This is just too much…surgeries are surgeries, and there are lots of people that need to go through this kind of experience for more serious motives if you think about it…so, I guess even this time it is all about not overdoing it…exageration is always wrong…

  222. Whenever I read someone mentioning PS, or someone doing PS, all I can think of is Playstation. I never heard plastic surgery called PS before :D

  223. yanagiba yusuke22

    i had cb from korea last week… i meet a girl with full of bandage all over her face, bandage on her nose shopping in myeongdong…shopping in 1 of cosmetic shop….1st i feel sorry for her n thought she had a terrible accident that makes her face ‘damaged’ or something…but later on my sis who stand bside her said that its so obvious she had done PS…. no wonder n PS is something natural for korean ppl…

  224. After having lived in Korea, I can tell most of the time if they’ve had plastic surgery. This “skill” has transferred on to even noticing it a lot more in Hollywood. Before plastic surgery really bugged me but I’ve gotten so used to Koreans getting plastic surgery that I usually don’t mind if it’s just a small tweak. However, I have stopped watching dramas because the main lead has had too much surgery. I just can’t focus on the plot because all I see is their overdone face. I was also disappointed in Minzy. Like you said, she has the right to do whatever she wants to herself but I ask myself why? High bridged noses are wayyyy over rated. I liked her nose before a lot more, she looked very cute now she looks alien (as in foreign not the creature that lives on Mars).

  225. Jase Aaron

    Minzy’s surgery made me sad, I thought her nose was really cute.

  226. This picture came to my mind for some reason.

  227. I think you did a good job with this topic and I’m glad you pointed out in your text post that it is not idols job to be “Korea’s self-esteem compass”. As long as it is a choice made by them personally (and this goes for all people and not just idols), without it being the result of succumbing to the pressure of their company/fans/family/etc, then people have nothing to be upset about. People have different connotations with the subject and it wouldn’t be right to force your own views and opinions upon the decision of others.

  228. Also, woah guys, what happened to the video quality (youtube, why you no HD!?!)

  229. thank you for this interesting tldr. i also was thinking, that plastic surgery might be a bit too accepted in korea.
    btw in germany it´s also very ommon to attach a picture of you to your cv. They are trying to change it and it´s not bad if you don´t put a picture in it. But many companys maybe (!) won´t call you for an interview beause of that (although they are not allowed to do that only because of this reason). The reason for this is, that the people from the company want to see the person who is applying beforehand, but they can´t accept you only because you´re more good looking than another.
    strange system.

  230. I do find the plastic surgery problem really serious. Everyone just looks the same. But I sort of have a different take on it. Just like how Koreans are quite competitive and always want to be ahead and just be better in everything, they want to perfect their face too. Don’t want tiny moles everywhere. Want CLEAR PERFECT skin. To a whole new level. They want their face to be perfect too. And although it wouldn’t be wrong to say koreans want to look more white, I don’t think they want to look Caucasian because they wanna be white, but rather because in reality, today’s beauty standards are more caucasian oriented. Black celebrities get hair weaves and nose jobs not because they don’t wanna be black but because in today’s standard, a wide nose isn’t exactly considered a positive feature. Same goes for flat noses in asians. They just want a more 3D-ness in their faces.
    And I think it also has something to do with getting jobs and just being judged by other people. I think everyone can agree, at first glance, you’d have a better first impression of a good looking person than a bad looking one (clothing styles and stuff put aside). And with all the same specs like the same college, same extra curricular activities, etc. Would the company choose the good looking person or bad looking person.
    I honestly think it’s a bit shallow but you can’t really blame them for reality… It wasn’t this bad just a few years ago but… I think it got really bad in like the past five to ten years.
    And this is my personal opinion but I don’t find those plastic looking faces attractive at all….

  231. Ok, it’s complicated to talk about this but I’ll say another side here. I’m brazilian and here is like ‘normal’ to see girls who wants to have a plastic surgery too! people here have that stereotype that girl should have big ass and boops and toned figure however last years we had many cases of people who died because trusted in false doctors. Brazil have a very high number of surgeries per year and it’s increasing! The point is, here the people don’t have money and the facilities to have a plastic surgery but the Tv and the celebrities here openly say what type of surgery you can take.
    I think that artist and celebrities should be a example for other to don’t do that and not the opposite ):
    Look at how many famous and talented idols in Korea who are judge as ‘ugly’ and are as successful as the other ones :)

    • you guys have that phrase too??? even in korea, people sometimes say ‘there are poor (or lazy) women, but no ugly women in the world.’

      • hahaha anyone who lives in Brazil know this phrase because here we have so many celebrities who were poor and ‘ugly’ but after so much money and PS they became as skinny and toned as models like magic o.O
        I believe that makeup is like magic but sometimes is too obvious.

  232. Oooh haven’t watched the video yet but such a serious topic gaiz O_O It’s really interesting that before my Korean Culture Obsession (KCO, or Kay Co for short), I didn’t approve of PS at all, now however, I’m more accepting of it. /strokes beard/ Interesting….

  233. A friend of mine just went to Korea to teach, she was telling us how girls there dont support them the “american way”

    Ex.

    American Girl: I’m fat

    American Girl: No you are beautiful the way you are.

    Korean Girl: I’m ugly.

    Korean Girl: Yes you need surgery asap.

    As a highschool teacher did you see this in your students?

    • I can’t help but feel like I’m being lied to every time someone says “no you’re fine the way you are”. Not in a necessarily 100% negative way , I guess. In Chinese culture, and it seems to me in Korean culture, well…we’re blunt people. Culturally speaking, we don’t see value to trying to go around the topic.

      And sometimes, that’s fine. Like if I had icky hair one day, I’d definitely want someone to point it out so I can fix it. I don’t believe we should coddle people too much, to the point where one expects everything to just come to them.

      On the other hand, I don’t believe one has to be harsh, either.There are ways of being blunt and honest without sounding hurtful. And there are ways of being not hurtful without being dishonest.

      Let’s just make this clear, one way is not better than the other.

      And let’s not lie to ourselves, here. America isn’t exactly all accepting of appearances and body types, either, especially not with women. Look at the media: it’s the same as in Korea; look how many successful actresses and celebrities are conventionally beautiful. Sure, you’ll have a few people who don’t fit the conventions of beauty but are still successful…but there aren’t that many, and I can’t help but feel a bit of tokenism goin’ on there.

      Look at the sizing in women’s clothing in North America. It frustrates me that there are separate clothing for “plus sizes”. Sure, some people might praise Forever XXII for having a decent selection for people sizes XL and up, but…there shouldn’t be that separation. People in those sizes shouldn’t have to be limited to just whatever’s in the “plus size” section.

      There is still a stigma to being “fat”, or anything over a size 6, really (and let’s not get started on how bloody stupid women’s sizes are…).

      So really, body (and appearance, in general) positivity needs to be worked on by a LOT of places and cultures. Let’s not pretend that America is any better.

      • But there is a difference–I’ve seen estimates that between 50-75% of Korean women have had plastic surgery! The main difference, I would argue, is that in the United States, requiring photos with resumes would get most employers sued–if you are not an actress or a model, you don’t have to be conventionally beautiful to make a living. I think if that photos-on-resumes stopped being the norm in Korea, demand for these procedures would fall way off.

        • Those estimate are wrong.

          In my country they ask for photos in their CVs to make sure the one going to the interview is the one sending in the resume. That’s pretty much it.

        • Well, they seem to be able to determine your identity here just fine without requiring a picture on the CV. Just saying.

        • I was just saying too lol Circumstances are different. Don’t see what’s wrong asking for a picture.

        • The reason it’s basically not legal here (unless the job is modeling/acting and requires a certain look) is because pictures historically have been used to weed out non-white job applicants.

        • I have an idea of what you mean by “here” but it’s outstanding that you assume I would know or I should know.

          And yeah I know about those, but that’s one place and in other places there are different circumstances.

        • I mean the country I referred to in the original post you replied to in this thread, i.e. the United States. I should note you have never referred to your country by name in this thread, but it’s outstanding that you assume I would know or I should know.

          In South Korea, at least according to the above video, Simon was denied employment on the basis of a CV photo–his skills, education, ability, and character were all disregarded in favor of a photograph. Maybe you think that’s wonderful and fair, but I do not.

        • I agree with Mary-B she had stated in her initial message her country, you were just to busy discrediting her because she rebuffed you that you where not paying attention to what she said. In stating her country it put her opinion into context, so maybe you should ‘know’ before directing you words in a somewhat malicious manner.

          I’m originally from Canada, and in the canadian school system high school students are required to take a class which teaches them how to properly develop their resumes, and conduct themselves in interviews. I remember the teacher telling our whole class that if any employer asked for a photo with our resume (an exception being made for jobs in the entertainment industry) “you should run away as fast as you can, because the job is sketchy and is probably some thing you shouldn’t/ don’t want to get mixed up in.” I will admit when I first realized it was the norm in Korea it shocked me, because it was so different from what I had been taught. I have noticed it is really common in other asian countries as well due to the highly competitive nature of the job market. I don’t see how it helps determine a person identity for the resume and interview process, if you send in a resume even if it is fake your going to put your picture on it, is it to do with the amount of people they call in for interviews, so they don’t get mixed up? I personally believe it is unfair to judge someone working capabilities on their appearance, and think that it is inevitable that bias would emerge from the photos, but the world isn’t fair.

        • I didn’t have any idea you read my other posts. And I didn’t have any intentions to make it clear what country I’m talking about though O.o so I’m not assuming anything.

          Where in my post did I say it was wonderful and fair lololol Don’t put words in my mouth. I merely said that requiring picture does not necessarily mean they will give you a job based on your looks. My experience is different, I’m not saying you are wrong, I just said circumstances can be different.

        • Priyanka

          Maybe there were too many people trying to fake their degrees or something. In some countries it is easier to do that compared to the US. Do Korean companies require a watermarked transcript sent directly from the university like they do in the US? How common is for people to fake their resumes?

      • A separate plus size section is practical though… the same styles that look good on thin women don’t look good on plus-size women,and vice versa.

        Calling a size-10 model “plus size” when that’s an average size for women in NA, on the other hand, is messed up.

        • I agree, a separate plus size section is practical. Same goes for tall, regular, and petite sizes. I know right away which sizes and proportions will fit me better. It’s the notion how people think that everything over a size 6 is “overweight” that is annoying.

        • I disagree. Are you a size 28 and you want to wear a mini-skirt? Go for it girl, you should be able to wear whatever you want regardless of what you, I or society thinks that looks “better” on you. Didn’t mean to came out as offensive, I just hate when we try to put our beauty standards on others.

        • I wasn’t even thinking of mini-skirts, more the cuts of dresses and collar shapes and so on. I will say that I hate it when shirts above size 8 are made with extra folds, as if the goal is to hide what you really look like.

        • The same styles that look good on me don’t look good on another US size 0. You can’t generalize what looks good on someone by their clothing size, and you damn sure can’t tell whether or not someone of this size wouldn’t want something that’s in the other size’s section or whether they’d think it’d look good on them. I don’t go clothing shopping for other people, I go shopping for ME, and so do my friends who are thin and my friends who are fat and my friends who are in between.

          It’s body-shaming. It’s there to ostracize plus size women and make them feel like they’re “other,” like skinny is the default that they weren’t able to fulfill. And almost invariably, the clothing in the plus-size section is more poorly made, less colorful, and just all-around uglier. Miles of beige and black. A desert of beige and black. As if fat women don’t deserve to be colorful and exciting and unique.

        • Agree with the second part, but for the first: well, isn’t that for the women buying and wearing the clothing to decide? Just because something doesn’t look good TO YOU doesn’t mean it doesn’t look good to the woman wearing it–the only person who’s opinion matters.

          Also, the styles, or rather, the shape and draping and such, of both “plus size” and “regular size” are similar enough, if you really take a look at them.

      • as far as american celebrities yes they are all beautiful but if you look at them they are all different. each actress or actor are different and unique but are all considered beautiful but in korea they almost blend in. sometimes im watching dramas or just new girl groups come out and it takes forever to just figure out whose who. in america there are different types of beauty. angelina jolie is beatiful but she does not look anything like anne hathaway or jennifer aniston who are just as beautiful. but can you really say that about korean celecrities? who have the same face shape and eye shape and body type? no. so yes body issues and image is important everywhere and that sucks but america does a better job at encouraging people to love them selves for who they are and having inner beauty and confidence to make up for what you think you lack whereas korea only fixes the physical aspect of the problem

        • Caitlin Martina Byrnes
          Caitlin Martina Byrnes

          i just wanted to comment that the thing you mentioned about korean actresses pretty much blending in together sometimes isnt necessarily plastic-surgery related but ethnicity related. angelina jolie(german, slovak, french canadian, dutch) and anne hathaway(irish, french, native american, german) and jennifer aniston(greek, italian, scottish, irish) all have completely different ethnic backgrounds while 99 percent of korean actresses you’re gonna see are purely korean. i personally think that if they want plastic surgery it’s none of our business but i do think that there is a heavy societal pressure that is specific to south korea(especially after reading what brad from busker busker had to say about his experience in that show)

        • JenniferSakraida

          I think leanna has a point. I find Japanese actresses a lot more distinctive than Korean actresses. I know Japanese idols and celebrities tend to have more distinctive features and sometimes have clauses in their contracts saying they can’t remove that “mole on their face” or “fix the bump on their nose.” Plus I think Japan is more accepting of mixed raced celebrities, like Crystal Kay, Becky, while I can’t think of anyone in Korea that would fall in that category.

        • But that’s because Korean are still a very, in the strict sense of word, pure race. They didn’t get mixed up with other races, so they are obviously going to look similar to an extent.

          I still see some white people and think they are similar, only to find out they aren’t. Just as I see some black people and think the same, and that’s because I might not be accustomed enough to their proportions or their aesthetics to notice the differences, because I don’t hang out, see them or interact with them enough like they do each other.

          That whole mentality of “America does a better job at encouraging people to love themselves” is a big pile of hypocritical bullshit. It’s called mollycoddling and nationalist empowerment because “omg we are the better human being you sallow Asian nutjobs”.

        • Actually I agree with you that America isn’t better at encouraging people to love themselves. It’s just our nation is so diverse/mixed that we have more standards to work with rather than other countries like Korea that has pretty much a set ideal. Tall stick skinny-oh you’re like a Caucasian model, a little more filled out-you have sexy curves like a latina, beauty standards r still there it’s just were mixed enough where if u can’t fit 1 u can try to work wit another ethnicity. Skinny still a universal trend though. What I think makes westerners so against plastic surgery is they think it’s a cop out. I saw a article about a guy who paid almost $90,000 on plastic surgery & even had muscle implants all over his body. He never excercised a day in his life yet he looked like a swimsuit model, & people were enraged cuz he didn’t work for his looks. Like “I work out daily, & nearly starve myself to death & u pay for lypo. That’s not fair u didn’t earn it!” Or I was born beautiful, I’m blessed. Ur average? Makeup should help you look better. You’re ugly? That’s ok u should love urself for who u are. But the second any of the lower category gets surgery to even the playing field. “Oh, that’s not natural.” Don’t get me wrong couldn’t do plastic surgery cuz I wouldn’t think that the person after was still me but I can understand reasons.

        • I personally wouldn’t say lack of diversity is as much of a problem as a greater emphasis on beauty. I’d argue that Korean celebrities are sometimes free-er to practice a variety of personal styles. For example, CL, Hyuna, and Amber each have their own unique definition of sexuality and style. Also, Amber and Eun Hye from Coffee prince have a boyish style which you don’t see in the US very much..
          And there are way more guy options and emphasis on male’s style and
          variety. I mean GD dyes his hair and changes its style more times than
          many female artists, and I can’t think of a comparable male celebrity in
          the US. Though there are male-fashion icons in the US I’d say the
          majority of male celebrities don’t put as much effort into dressing for
          events and music videos as female celebrities, whereas in Korea this is
          more equal. So I wouldn’t necessarily say that there is less diversity.
          at least from what I’ve seen in the media. Though there are obviously
          other problems with image.

        • Isn’t a bit rude to say all Korean celebrities almost blend in? Are you implying you think they all look the same? That sounds similar to what a racist school boy would say. Koreans are one race, so yes they do all have similar eye shapes and physical features. Whereas Americans are made up of many, many different races, so of course physical differences in American people are very easy to spot.

        • Don’t forget that Korean media also has diversity as well. Kpop idols look uniquely beautiful to me. Hyorin from Sistar looks nothing like Hyoyeon from SNSD, who looks nothing like CL from 2NE1, who looks nothing like Sohee from Wonder Girls. Yet all of them are gorgeous in their own ways. Same goes for the boys of Kpop. Actors and Actresses also are quite different (Gu Hyesun, Park Shinhye, Nam Gyuri, etc).

          What you’re looking at isn’t Korean media, it’s the ulzzang trend. Ulzzangs and models and high schoolers who have cosmetic surgery tend to look similar, because when it comes to ulzzangs, it’s very clear on what is beautiful, and there isn’t too much leeway on the subject.

          Also, take a look at American advertisements. Watch any commercial for men’s cologne. There is always a girl taking her clothes off and/or dancing sexily, and she’s always thin and tall and white with long hair and smokey eye makeup. The requirements for modeling agencies are also ridiculously restricting, if you look at them. And don’t forget those magazines that point out every celebrity’s flaws. Yet if a woman gets cosmetic surgery, she is looked down upon for not accepting herself. It’s like “Oh, your body is terrible, your nose is awful, and you look horrible without makeup… but why don’t you love yourself?”

          So I don’t think we have a right to say that any place is better than another when it comes to image. Every country has both good and bad points, and it’s not fair to say that one if above the other.

        • I can see the point you’re making, but just because Korea has a more …uh, I guess, “consistent” set of beauty standards than, say America, doesn’t mean that America is any better at it. Yes, Korea seems to be more rigorous in what they think is beautiful, but that does NOT mean America is good, or better than another country, at encouraging “people to love themselves”. Korea’s issues with beauty lie mostly in the face; America’s in the body. Two sides, same coin.

          And I can’t help but feel a little….well, the whole “can you say that about Korean celebrities” sounds a little too much like “all Asians look the same”. Not sure if that’s your intention, whether conscious or not…but you’re really looking at this from perhaps a Western or American point of view.

          The truth is that, if you’re not as familiar with people, you’re not as likely to be able to pick them out from other people who look similar, i.e. of the same race. There are a LOT of girl groups coming up, it’s hard to keep up with all of them, so yeah, they all look similar because they have similar features, not just because of surgery, but because anthropology and psychology. Conversely, the celebrities in America are more constant; you have mostly the same people. They become more familiar; you might not know who they are but you’ll see the same constant set of people often, compared to Korean entertainment where there’s newbies and rookies and such EVERY YEAR. A LOT of them, might I add.

          Does it change the fact that a lot of plastic surgeries have a conformity issue? Nope. A lot of people ARE getting the same sort of, “major” changes, where as plastic surgery in America seems to me more minor; Botox for wrinkles, maybe a bit of a nose job, etc, etc. Most people don’t change their eye (except wrinkles) because eye shape isn’t a part of America’s beauty “standards”. BUT. A lot of people are trying to lose weight, trying to conform to this singular idea of a beautiful body. Like I said, Korea might focus on the face, but America is basically the same with the body. You rarely see body diversity–at least not for women–in the media. Those who fall outside of that “standard” body are either crucified for it or are raised as martyrs for “being different”, when in fact, everyone in the real world is “different”.

        • “but if you look at them they are all different.”
          that’s because america is much more diverse to begin with. Korea is a very homogenous country, you cannot make such a comparison

      • And it’s not like it’s something taboo as Martina and Simon said. People freely talk about others and themselves getting it. I don’t see any hush hush about it. Articles are made about nose jobs and boob jobs and butt jobs and people also shave their jaws. A good example is Jennifer Aniston.

        The reason it might seem more a little it’s because, and I don’t mean to say this in an offensive way but a very objective one, people are hypocrites like that lol. They don’t outright say it because they pretend looks are not that big of a deal. At least Koreans are open to admit what they want and how to get it.

      • yeah I never said that “the american way” was better… I just want to know if it was real or my friend just blow things out of proportion.

    • The problem here is that there is a honesty factor in here. I’ve had the impression that Koreans are just frank people. I’d rather have that than polite hypocrisy. Westerns like to brag about the “you are so beautiful because you all come in all forms and shapes safdkajfsd” as if they were the special spiritual snowflakes who are obviously better human beings when cosmetic surgery was invented by them lol

      I think you went overboard though, if you are going to judge a situation judge it with the same arguments:

      American Girl: I’m fat.
      American Girl: No, you are beautiful the way you are.
      Korean Girl: I’m FAT.
      Korean Girl: Yes, you need to lose weight.

      American girl: I’m ugly.
      American girl: No, you are beautiful the way you are.
      Korean Girl: I’m ugly.
      Korean Girl: Yeah you are. Have you considered getting something done?

      You see what I did there? I left fat to fat and ugly to ugly. Your original analogy made it seem like the Korean girl was the worst.

      • If you actually read my post I was asking if that was real…

      • Plastic surgery wasn’t invented by America…in fact, plastic surgery dates back as far as ancient Rome and India. The modern father of plastic surgery is actually from New Zealand. Also, the reason we say “you are beautiful just the way you are” and things like that is not because we think we are all high and mighty.

    • In Korean culture it is not considered rude to make comments on body to a good friend or family member, of course in the appropriate context (it can still hurt feelings, though but not always). It is a very different social context and cultural space.

  234. This totally made me think of that article I read about an asian woman being divorced because her babies were ugly. I guess she was not as attractive before her surgery and her husband claims he was lied to… Not awesome

    I did notice that one of my 3rd years at my middle school just had her eyelids done. I saw her with bandages on her eyes and freaked out a little until another girl was like… “eyelid surgery!” I really can’t tell the difference, but it made her happy. Who am I to judge when I got braces when I was younger. That may sound weird but that’s what I relate eyelid surgery to… it’s simply cosmetic and so were my braces so yup.
    The end.

  235. Minzy never said she didn’t have a nose job for the sake of having a nose job. She’s always said she had rhinitis so she just decided to do a nose job at the same time.

  236. QUESTION: If plastic surgery in Korea doesn’t have a negative association to it why do celebrities deny it? Do regular people who have it done proudly claim their new feature or do they also try to hide the fact anything was done? Also did you hear about that case in China where the man sued his wife for not telling him she got (a LOT of) work done and when the kids came out not as beautiful as the couple he was SO freak’n mad.

  237. There was recently an article in the news about how this man sues his ex-wife for ugly kids. She had gotten a lot of plastic surgery and didn’t tell him about it… http://www.fox8live.com/story/23915313/man-sues-ex-wife-for-having-ugly-baby

  238. Yup… the same face… so many times I thought I’ve seen a Korean friend but it’s just a girl that has had all the same surgeries.

    One of our friends was saying the other day about a friend in Korea whose wife is very pretty – but had all the surgeries. When they had a baby there was a noticeable difference in the kid’s appearance and the mother’s surgically altered appearance.

    I don’t like my nose much, though my husband likes it, but now I’m kinda worried someone in Korea will tell me to get it fixed! haha.

    I know these girls getting the same plastic surgery are expecting their lives to be better with their new look but I’d like to know how happy they actually are. Especially when it comes to love. I’ve never heard a Korean guy say that he loves a girl with all those surgeries done, but I’m constantly hearing about how much Korean guys hate that look. I just wonder how things work out for them. Also health wise… since they can be so invasive.

    • I’m starting to kinda think of plastic surgery in Korea in a similar vein to tattoos in North America. People permanently modify their body for a look that they’re happy with. Yes, it’s not how they look naturally, but it makes them look better/cooler/whatnot, so why not?

      • Thats actually a really good point. I never thought about that but it is basically the same

        • Gabby Hernandez

          I kinda disagree because Johnny Depp once said that his tattoos were a story and that his body was a journal and I also see tattoos that way.

        • And? Not everything has to be a story. He got his tattoos for him, not for someone else. You don’t have to find something deep and magical for it to be okay for a person to do. There’s nothing deep and meaningful about half the tattoos I want to get, are you going to shame me for those? For what I want to put on my own body?

        • Tbh, I think you’re overreacting to what Gabby Hernandez’s comment. No where did they say or imply half of the things you said (i.e shaming someone, not being okay, etc).
          They only said that plastic surgery =/= getting tattoos. Some people get tattoos for the “story” reason or to mark an occasion (an uncle of mine got the names of al of his children done on his arm in a design), but there is no story reason behind plastic surgery.

      • My view has definitely changed from being around Koreans a lot. Years ago I would have been like “omg plastic surgery is terrible!” but these days it’s just such a common thing that my views have relaxed a lot. It’s also hard to be so critical when you know so many people that have had something done.

      • I’m not so sure…if I see someone with a tattoo I’ll definitely think that it’s body art whereas plastic surgery doesn’t have that “artistic” feel to it. Also, you can get a tattoo removed if you really want to and I’ve never heard of someone cancelling out a plastic surgery…

        • Ash3070

          Actually it is possible for surgeons to undo it. I read a “real life” story in a magazine recently about someone who’d gotten a tonne of them and now really regretted it. She was getting all the procedures reversed but all that money gone down the drain and all that pain for nothing…..x x x

        • whoa…I didn’t know it actually was possible. It must be even more expensive especially if you’re fixing bone shaving or something that’s not skin or fat. But I assume most people have to live with what they get considering the insane price tag…

      • But with tattoos (Most of the time) it’s something personal and individual with the person getting it with the opposite effects in the job and social part as opposed to the plastic surgery you guys talked about- where they all look the same with benefits of job positions and social acceptance. So I really don’t think the two can be compared??

        • Changing your appearance because of something you don’t like in it is personal and individual. A lot of plastic surgery is done for personal reasons.

          We can’t look at plastic surgery like it’s in a vacuum, separated from society. We have to acknowledge when we discuss it that a lot of it is being done because society imposes a beauty standard of what’s acceptable and what isn’t—which most if not all societies do, and it’s all bullshit, regardless of what the beauty standard is. But that doesn’t mean bash on plastic surgery and throw it out as “this is a horrible thing” over that. Treat the cause, not the symptom. Treating the symptom doesn’t make that problem go away and what’s more, it doesn’t even really acknowledge that the cause is a problem.

          There is NOTHING wrong with plastic surgery. It’s a wonder of modern medicine and technology; if you don’t like something, it’s completely within your power to change that, and that’s amazing. We’ve literally attained something that we used to see as something only magic could make happen. It’s glorious. No one should be shamed for wanting to change their appearance.

          But no one should be shamed for having a certain appearance, either. We need to abolish the beauty standard as a concept and stop putting everyone we see up against some kind of checklist. We need to stop basing a person’s worth on how their face is configured, what texture their hair is, how much space they occupy, etc. And don’t think I’m saying that that’s something Korea needs to do, because that’s rampant in the US and Canada. We may not have pictures on our resumes but we’re fucking horrible to people we don’t find conventionally attractive, especially women. THEN we can celebrate plastic surgery as a marvel of modern science and a wonderful thing for people who want to do it, as we should.

      • Denise

        I think I disagree with that. I think a tatoo is something that you add to the body that you already have, it’s something extra and, as someone mentioned before, it’s art. Plastic surgery is altering your body’s structure and shape, so I don’t think it’s the same thing. But I don’t condemn any of it, if it makes you feel better about yourself, good. I don’t necessarily agree with the premise but I won’t judge. However, people THINK they are going to feel better but they never actually do. There have been a couple of studies that show that an event that happened 3 months ago (not a major event, like the death a parent, for instance), give or take, it has no weight on your actual state of happiness (or unhappiness). One study shows that we synthesize happiness, it doesn’t depend on external events. I thought that was common sense but apparently it isn’t. Well, that was a tangent! Haha
        But I think it’s relevant anyways. PS.: Great vid! o/

    • I always wondered how people feel after plastic surgery. I have a thought that I would be traumatized to not recognize myself when I look at the mirror. It may look beautiful but it’s odd… Do they get used to their new face? Do they really like to see that new face on them?

    • Cara Rose

      good point. I wonder where this issue ties in with the ‘Ideal’ Korean woman, and dating… are ladies in Korea more upfront about what surgeries they’ve had when they go on blind dates? or is this something that you tell your man AFTER the wedding??
      *also interesting to me because [random side note] I am adopted, but people say I look exactly like my Mom…

      • I went and questioned my husband about this and he said it depends on the person. For some people it’s really obvious that they have had surgery and they’ll say they have, but not everyone will be open about it. Some people will never admit to it, even to their husbands. If they did it at a young age they can get away with not telling sometimes.

        Though lately, with so many girls having the exact same face – it would be interesting to see in 10 years time whether their surgery affected them negatively or positively.

        • Cara Rose

          especially considering the students who’re recieving it as reward for high achievment in school. By the time they’re 26 do they would they have to go back into the clinics for ‘touch-ups’… do the more common surgeries degrade overtime?? AND if so how would a wife/gf potentially ‘hide’ that they had something re-re-done? o.O = vicious cycle
          so much to contemplate, very serious thought provoking video guise…

    • Oh your words “I’ve never heard a Korean guy say that he loves a girl with all those
      surgeries done, but I’m constantly hearing about how much Korean guys
      hate that look.” but I think they don’t like their girl to not reach the common standard either?? is it kinda hypocrite??

  239. The only plastic surgery I would consider is a boob reduction. And that’ll be when I’m old and they’re killing my back. Until then i’m going to be happy to keep every little imperfection I have because they’re mine and no one else has them.

  240. Hi Simon and Martina did you know that the countries with the highest plastic surgery rates in order are Korea, Greece, Italy, Brazil, Colombia, USA and finally Taiwan

  241. It’s kind of wierd… Cause I heard the exact meaning of the Korean word for plastic surgery before and and on a overall it kind of did change my views on plastic surgery as well.. and like now I just kind of don’t see a problem with it….just in certain scenario I just don’t agree to get it in…like the one when you guys said extremely young kids get it.. and other reasons also but on a overall I dont really mind it and I was kind of wanting to get one myself lol

  242. This is one of the reason that kind of makes me happy to live in Sweden, and the fact that I am adopted. The very idea of changing for something like this is utterly ridonkeylous to me. Sure, I had things done to me, braces and facial treatments, but none that cannot be motivated by anything else than medical reasons.

    Braces- my dentist actually told me to do so, or my teeth would hurt me. So I did that, while taxes still paid for it, so it was free.

    Facial treatment, as in skin treatments to some strange hole-phenomena that happens to me randomly… and it really didn’t do too much to change it.

    But still, to me everyone is beautiful the way we are, and that is the way we are. Also, I kind of fear (from what I’ve read) that plastic surgery isn’t really going to save the beauty-ideals… I mean, I understand kind of what this originates from, as the Asian look is very much more monotone than if you live in Europe (like me), where people look a lot more different. But still… if you change the population to make them all look the same, do you still stand out?

  243. Can you tell us where you went for your mole removals? Thanks!!

  244. martina should have “fixed” that guy’s nose on the spot when he said martina should fix her nose LOL

  245. I remember reading somewhere that Minzy did need surgery for rhinitis and her mother had been nagging her to also get her nose fixed along with the surgery and so that is what she did which I find quite sad that is was pressure from family. Also on the issue I found a song on the topic that thought was really powerful by Nuol and San.E: (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QHI3yz38tu8) reading the lyrics really hit me hard. Anyway, love your videos and your blog posts~ Keep up the good work :)

    • Yeah I find it disturbing that her Mother of all people pressured her into doing it. Also appenrantly she was concerned because Minzy wasn’t as thin as the other members. What the hell is that all about. This might all be bullshit though, seeing as this is coming from all k-pop

    • AJ Jung

      wow powerful song…why can’t topics like this be in more mainstream music??!?! If idols sang songs about topics about confidence and inner beauty maybe it would be better and the younger generation would feel more inspired to love themselves than another version of someone else. (sigh)

      • but they will be like hypocrite, since probably 80% had something done.. I’ve heard these girl groups consist with 3 rather chubby girl.. I forget the group names, something along pig and girl (?) but then the next comeback they became thin lol.. and after that the former member dismissed and the company change all the member.. what the.. lol

        • Piggy Dolls?
          In the states, when a plus sized celebrity loses weight, some people rejoice while plus sized fans are disappointed that they no longer have an icon to point to. So those celebrities are forced to lose but not lose too much, so they can still keep their fanbase. it’s kinda silly when you think about it. The person shouldlook however they want to feel healthy and comfortable.

        • Yes!! piggy dolls lol!! I see.. well, I thought piggy dolls was being marketed as their current image, being pigggy like (?) that time.. they even named as piggy dolls.. i was like !@*!)(*@ when they being thin and moreover being replaced with even thinner girls

  246. Okay, please tell me that I was not the only one who tried to stick their thumb in their nose at the end of this video? Please!!!!

  247. I have a question for you guise… Why did you have your moles removed? I remember Martina being all shocked that a guy told her to get rid of that “blemish”, and she was like “I have this beauty mark since I was born!” So, what made you change your mind?

    As for my opinion on plastic surgery, I’m ok with it as long as the point is not to make you more “standard”, more “normal”… It’s a pity to throw away features that make you unique. I’m also sad for Minzy’s nose, as well as for Seungri’s teeth, I also think these “unperfect” details made them look adorable. But for instance Tablo’s wife (I don’t remember her name… The actress in Old Boy and Why did you come to my house) got full PS and doesn’t have the common post-PS doll look, not even close! I don’t really know what to think of it, but well, at least she doesn’t look like a random “after” poster!

    • When moles grow bigger or disproportionate, there’s a small chance of skin cancer. We were concerned, so we got them removed. We kept all other moles that looked fine :D

    • Well mole removal is necessary when they start to change… I had the same thing happen do me… I had a mole right under my lip since early childhood (I can’t remember a time when I didn’t have it) and I liked my ” beauty mark” especially because of a song in mexico that said “Ese lunar que tiene, cielito lindo junto la boca, no se lo des a nadie cielito lindo que a mi me toca” :) However I had to get it removed because it was growing, it took me over a year to decide to take it off especially since just that one mole removal cost me 200 US dollars. sad times. At least it didn’t leave a scar… though I think it’s growing again, just not as dark as before… ( I didn’t do the more invasive mole removal technique that basically cuts down in a triangular shape to get the “roots” as it were, Instead I had them basically freeze and shave it off… still… in a couple of years I’ll have to do it again… but the other way might have left a scar that I didn’t want).

  248. Wow,the swappy thingy scares me so much right now.

  249. I don’t understand the Korean obsession with plastic surgery and certain looks being unacceptable. My Korean wife explains it as “They want to look more American (meaning “more white”).” What’s wrong with looking Asian?
    Frankly, it’s more than a little disturbing that there is such a thing as a “cultural addiction to plastic surgery.”

    • the media plays a BIG role in the popularity of surgery.
      you rarely see asian looking celebs who are considered beautiful.
      the only people who look asian and are considered pretty are Sandara Park, Ga-In and Yuna Kim (she’s a figure skater, but she is a celebrity)

      • “the only people who look asian and are considered pretty ”

        they’re surely not the only ones

        • Jackie Outlaaw

          well, sure they are not the only ones. i’m just saying that the number of ‘asian looking and beautiful according to the media’ celebs are minorities in korea.

    • Its not more American, its more white skin. Pale skin is very prized in Asia, has been for eons. Royalty, nobility, upperclass was associated with with white skin (not in the fields working) and that has carried over to today. Even though tan skin relates to being outdoor or healthy and desirable in America it is not so in Asia. Heck look at the “face-kini” they wear in at China beaches.

      • thank you for this. It’s such a misconception that people think asians want to look American or European. Having a pale skin is desirable, just like having a tan in the west is. It’s not like we want to look like i.e African-Americans, but it’s just desirable

      • Not stating my opinion here. But I think David Miles also meant the desire for higher nose bridges, bigger eyes, and double eyelids which are more common in European features.

        Now onto me being subjective… I was so sad when my cousin who has naturally darker skin said she didnt want to play because the sun was shining and she didnt want to get darker. She was 7 at most. I think the fact that her little sister who has light skin and big eyes has affected her self-esteem. Everyone but European-North Americans still have these traditional mindsets of darkness, beauty, and status.
        So… What is a face-kini? o_O

  250. Very scary with the swapping thing… i know many people from Sweden travel to Thailand for cheap surgeries but i doubt they’ve ever taken that in consideration!

  251. Fun Fact!!
    did you know a Chinese man successfully sued his wife after they had 3 children and all their children were ‘Extremely ugly’. turned out she had plastic surgery before their marriage, lol

    • HA! You know, we actually talked about that in the video, but we weren’t sure if he was Chinese or not, and we didn’t want to get scolded if we got it wrong, so we cut it out. But, yes, we heard about that as well!

      • It’s actually a good thing you cut that out, because there is speculation that whatever article that information came from is fake. In fact, there was an article that was dated over a year ago talking about that same picture, only the picture in question was from a plastic surgery clinic in Taiwan with the caption “The only thing you have to worry about after having plastic surgery is how to explain it to your kids”. Idk if that article is legit itself…it’s the internet after all. But even more than that, China isn’t a big suing culture. It’s actually a very taboo and shameful thing to involve others in one’s personal matters, so for a Chinese to sue over looks is kind of a reach.

  252. My Korean Culture professor (who is from Korea) said that everyone looks the same, so don’t feel bad saying everyone looks the same. He said that when he went back to Seoul for break last year, he was walking and he saw one woman…and then he saw her again. But he didn’t! These women that he saw simply looked the same. So yeah…even Koreans think they are all starting to look the same.

  253. Honestly, IMO, here in the West, I think many more of us would do PS if it was a cheap and looked as good as PS in Korea. I don’t know if it would get to the same level as in Korea, but still. Tons of Americans do PS, even popular YT beauty gurus, once you have money.Personally, I have nothing against it, as long as you don’t go overboard or look totally different. If you basically look the same, and I can’t really see a big difference it’s fine. And as long as you are honest with your partner about your real looks.People say not to judge a book by its cover, so why do they judge books that get new covers? Plastic surgery =/= low self-esteem. That’s like saying hair dye = low self-esteem or makeup = low self-esteem. But I do think people should be satisfied with how they were made.

    Your nose is cuuttee!

    • that’s actually a really good point. a lot of people judge those who got cosmetic surgery, and they always teach their children or younger siblings not to judge a book by their cover.
      i do think it’s better to stick to what you have unless you were bullied a lot for your looks or have severe functional problems, but i think it’s also problematic to consider someone ‘bad’ for getting fixed.
      why not try to change the society before destroying some people’s feelings?
      i’ve seen some celebs who got crushed by netizens calling them surgery monsters.

  254. I am just wondering if a Korean man would get something fixed?Or does this whole plastic surgery thing in Korea only apply to women…

    • nope it definitely applies to guys as well. A guy getting PS is not uncommon at all. (:

      • Do people also have “whitening” surgeries? Because it confuses me how idols can have such perfect looking white skin. Or is it all just make-up? ( NO offense no anyone)

        • HipsterTikal

          It’s a bit of both, some actually undergo surgery, but Korea’s BB cream is magical. BBcream in Korea usually have a high SPF, which makes your skin look whiter. You can see that in photo’s (their face looks much more white than the rest of their body) http://i01.i.aliimg.com/img/pb/466/945/106/106945466_514.JPG you can see this in this picture, one side of her hand is much more white than the other half. There are also other products which claim to whiten your skin tone, but I am not sure whether this actually works or not. It’s save to say that companies mostly use makeup/video-editing/photoshopping rather than nonstop plastic surgery.

        • XxmycrapbookxX

          Oh thank you. I kind of thought that something they ate makes them whiter and taller…hehe

    • No there are definitely Korean men who get plastic surgery! On the posters they often show both men and women, and Kyuhyun and Shindong from Super Junior both have had surgeries.

      • yanagiba yusuke22

        agree… even kyucumber is my bias, i admit he had PS esp his eyes…n they didnt denied it

      • Yes many Korean male idols get surgeries done. Rain makes a big stink about how he DIDN’T get surgery even with all the pressure.

      • I remember a strong heart episode where Eunhyuk mentioned “gifts” that SMent would give their idols and that when he went in for evaluation the doctor or someone not sure who told him that it was better not to do anything since if he did he’d have to change everything… I was like o_O what crazyness… first PS as a “gift” and then being told by someone that you’d have to change everything… I’m glad Eunhyuk didn’t get anything changed though since his look is so HIM i can’t even begin to imagine him looking different.

    • they do. i live here, so i would know. but the number of men getting it is extremely low compared to women’s

  255. I got surgery for rhinitis and my doctor asked me if I wanted to do my nose (I said no) so I think it was the same for her it’s like “Since you’re already going to have surgery might as well have ps too” It’s not that the PS will heal you, it’s doing both things at once… since you’re already going to have surgery might as well do both things at the same time like a saying in my county ‘todo en un solo dolor’ (all in one pain) lol

    • Exactly. I don’t really like my nose either, but i’m not going to get plastic surgery anytime soon. BUT if I really needed to have a surgery for rhinitis then I would consider changing my nose as well. I mean, why not kill two birds with one stone? They’re going to cut my nose open anyways so why not change the shape while they’re on it >_<.

      • Yup… I didn’t do it because I wasn’t really sure if I wanted to change something so noticeable and it’s been like a year and I really don’t regret it, besides I avoided the pain that comes with it hahaha

      • Blueberries

        Well I don’t like my nose, it’s too large and pointy.. but I doubt I’d like new nose either ^^;

    • Exactly what I have been saying, it is like a “since we are at it why don’t we do both” It is a personal decision and something that maybe you wouldn’t get a surgery just for it but since for health reasons you have to do it why not doing that other thing that you have been wanting?
      I think people have been taking this Minzy issue too seriously and I don’t think that Simon and Martina can talk about her personal case, just stick to the surgery in general in Korea if not let’s talk about the Idols Factory that SM has with 90% of his artists going through surgery.
      Please try to be more objective.
      Thanks.

      • I get their point as in she’s a role model but the at the same time she’s human and when people tells you everyday that you’re ugly it’s hard to keep your self steem high…Yeah SM idols have had ps but if I were to talk about idols that had ps I would talk about kwanghee and Bom

        • Mimi Chan 비

          Exactly and yeah I won’t deny any ps from any idol, I think it is not something to hide, or be ashamed of what I meant is that Minzy or YG is not the only one. If we were to talk about idols with PS we would have to talk about like 80-90% of idols? I just used it as an example but many idols had plastic surgery and won’t change my opinion on their personality or talent.
          For me Minzy was and is still beautiful ^^

        • Yeah but I mean people who have gone overboard with ps… I mean like 80% of idols have done ps but they mostly do minimal stuff like eyelids or teeth… others get their nose and eyelids but they still remain with the same face which is ok… then you have people like kwanghee that changed everything, idk….

        • Mimi Chan 비

          Yeah, we have the same point there. I mean there are many idols that, in my opinion, were really beautiful before all the ps. But like they say here the ps culture in Korea is more common that what we can imagine. idk I won’t judge them and I hate when people does when they are not on those people’s shoes to know why they decided to do it.

        • oh yes, I also wonder how about kwanghee!! he even confess it himself in SH lol I kinda shocked and surprised. But it still doesn’t change the fact that he is quite funny and entertaining lol.. have bom ever confessed or hint something about her ps?? never, I think.. even after Bom kinda abvious look change, YG still said everywhere their artists are natural.. lol.. what a joke

        • Yeah the subject of Bom and PS have come up several times and YG has always denied it even tho it’s so obvious, even her voice has changed…

        • Really though. The whole kpop world knows she got plastic surgery. It was fine to deny it before when she still looked like herself but come on she went from being the prettiest one in the group to now anytime anyone mentions her looks its PS talks. And yes her voice unfortunately got worse but that might be from misuse since she has been singing out of her range for the past couple years. I keep thinking of that video of her recoding for GD. She was forcing her voice over and over again. imagine doing that for years. she can end up with vocal cord nodules doing that

        • sticksandbones

          What YG said was that in the new girl group there was a non-PS clause for them…
          But he never said all YG Family was natural, that would be ridiculous, the perfect example would be Gummy, who was part of it and she admitted getting PS.

  256. I personally think Plastic Surgery is okay, if you don’t overdo it. If you, yourself are unhappy with how you look, go fix it. But don’t change everything and that’s what scares me about so many korean girls and boys. As seen at the end of the video, you see how changed their faces are to the point where it looks way too unnatural. That, I don’t find okay and tbh I find it really ugly aswell….

    • Plastic surgery can be the solution for some people, but not for everyone. There are many cases of people who feel bad about themselves and focus their dissatisfaction on one part of their body, thinking that by changing it they would feel much better… But once it’s done, their problem is not solve and their lack of self-esteem swich to another part of their body. That’s why in some country people have to see a counseller before going for plastic surgery, but regarding what Simon and Martina said about mental health in a previous TL;DR, that’s not ready to happen in Korea…

      • but that isn’t a big portion of the people who get plastic surgery, luckily. (:

        • Blueberries

          Actually it’s big part of those who got PS. Many gets obsessed of surgeries since the problem of feeling unpretty comes from insecurity and society’s pressures not from physical appearance itself. So one surgery can make people happy with themselves a little while but they will notice then something else of their faces or body that are the “problem”.

        • It’s not the majority of people who get plastic surgery. It’s just that those are the people whose plastic surgery is obvious. Most people who get plastic surgery have little changes that we can’t see. Those who go overboard or who obsess over fixing a nonexistent problem are the ones that we hear tabloid stories about and the ones that we can see as obviously having had work done.

        • HipsterTikal

          well actually it isnt a big portion. But so many people get PS, that the small portion is still a big absolute number. plus it is always those obsessed ones you hear about, not the ones who stop after getting 1/2 things done.

    • Caitlin Martina Byrnes
      Caitlin Martina Byrnes

      I think that if getting plastic surgery makes you feel good about yourself or makes you happy then you should go ahead and do it! It’s your life and your the only person who has to live with yourself at the end of the day so do what makes you happy.

  257. SAME SAME BUT DIFFERENT

  258. Martina your nose is beautiful.
    OMG Simon’s resume reaction *rolls down my sexy window* heeeeeeey

  259. Hey guise like the video, just one thing, the plastic in plastic surgery, comes from the greek word plastike, meaning to mold or reshape, not the synthetic material. So the Korean literal translation might not be that off from the original meaning.

    • We were talking more about the current connotations for plastic, rather than the original definition of plastike. Words change meaning over time, all the time :D

      • Ohk I was more referring to how 성형 gives an accurate representation of the original meaning, as opposed to the english version ^^

      • Minzy didn’t say she get cosmetic surgery for the rhinitis, she want to get a NORMAL surgery for that, and her mom advice her since she’s doing it, go and make it prettier! so she did Cosmetic surgery to get prettier but her first thought is about fixing her rhinitis which makes her hard to sing(just like taemin , every fans know he get it done for the same reason)

        • well maybe every people who get rhinitis should do ps too as a bonus.. then again if they really want to cure it just for the sake of health, they don’t necessarily had to do ps either.. I kinda agree with Simon n martina’s notion. I don’t diss those idol really.. I’m kinda accepting this phenomenon as ‘bizzare’ thing in kpop world now as well as I can’t believe everything broadcasted regarding their appeareance either (height,ps,etc) and there’s no use to deny it too.. like maybe korean people view the ps thing as normal as doing tonsillectomy.. eventhough I won’t and I can’t do it ever. The idol said it just for the sake to let the fans know (oh well) they love themselves, but y know, theyre people too *IknowI’mbeingcynical *suemeplease

        • i didn’t say she did it because rhinitis nor Minzy said it! She admit she done it to get prettier! just saying her first thought is fixing her rhinitis but her mom advice her to get prettier! didn’t mean she get it for the rhinitis, she get both surgery! please don’t distort what i said, i just wanna tell Simon & Martina the article they saw is totally not the whole thing, just telling them.

        • It is true that she wanted to just get normal surgery for rhinitis (at least according to the article which I feel it gets misinterpreted by a lot of people). I actually feel that her mom sounded harsh on her; I mean a mother is supposed to love their kids with all their flaws no matter what, you could be the ugliest kid on the world but in a mother’s eyes you’re the most beautiful creature ever. On a funny side, I did not notice her nose surgery until she mentioned it (which is kind of ironic since I have 2ne1 posters). When the article about her manager trying to deny plastic surgery rumors came out I was confused because I never heard of the rumors or anything. I think her nose was lovely the way it was before (now that I see newer pictures and see old pictures of her). At the same time I don’t really care what she does to her face or body (as long as she doesn’t over do it pr does something that may damage her vocal cords) I am more interested in the way she sings and dances.

        • i honestly get hurt a little bit just like Simon & Martina for a while(im ok now), she looks so cute last time and her face remind me of Mulan. But im with u, didn’t really care , still love her! anyway her mom is not harsh on her, she love Minzy so much. She ADVICED it because all those netizen has been saying how she don’t look as pretty as other surgery face probably since her debut! And also she didn’t look as slim as other member even though she worked out so much, her mom even lost 10kg to motivate her(losing weight isn’t a bad thing IMO) Minzy said her mom is both her parents and her friend. during Minzy’s trainee time, there are alot of hardship she gone through, everytime she wanna give up, her mom cheer her up, telling her she is like fermented kimchi, yes it sounds silly but the meaning is that, with fermented kimchi they can make so many many many different dishes. YG told her she will debut after 2 years training but she eventually didn’t get debut after 4 year and wanted to give up from time to time but her mom keep cheering on her, since she started, wasn’t it a waste(her mom told her).And she finally made her debut after 4 years

        • and i watched this on Mama Mia

        • I din’t know all those details (and I’m a BlackJack myself). I’m really glad Minzy din’t give up because she is such an amazing singer and dancer. I’m with you on losing weight being good for your health (unless you’re super skinny then it may lead to problems such as eating disorders). The point is to be within your ideal range in the BMI scale (btw I sometimes put things on a public health perspective cuz that’s my major field of study ^^).

        • And his nose is pretty much back to the slight hook he used to have when younger. Everyone was saying how he got it done but those were just fillers back then.

        • do u know what u r talking about? getting cosmetic/plastic surgery is illegal for those underage…she just become an adult this year, what did u mean by fillers back then? or did u assume she is doing illegal things when her group is (quite) successful?

        • No it’s not O.o Do your research. You are allowed to as long as you have the permission of your parents. The double eyelid surgery for a person’s sixteenth birthday was and still is a little bit of a trend. It’s not recommended because a teenager is still growing so having surgery so early on does not secure a permanent change, because your body is still growing and you are still changing.

          And I was talking about Taemin. Learn to read before coming onto me lol Everyone was attacking SM for making Taemin and Minho do their noses, but seeing how they are now it was obvious the change were fillers, not nose jobs.

          And I don’t see how success has anything to do with surgeries. There is Park Bom after all.

  260. Cara Rose

    I wanna know the breakdown of blogging for next TLDR

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